Airfares Cost By Total Weight

http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/why-airlines-charge-fat-passengers-120203449.html</a>

Heard of this before and never thought too much about it. I can see that for the airline a flight has a number of fixed and other variable costs (e.g. the pilot and crew are paid the same whatever the weight in the aircraft, the aircraft cost is fixed whatever weight it is carrying, etc. whilst fuel to keep the aircraft in the air does depend to an extent on the weight of passengers and luggage).

So to me it seems fair that the price of a flight varies according to total weight you are responsible for in the aircraft. I assume that airlines like most businesses calculate their costs (based on average weights, fixed costs, etc.) and then add their margin, etc. to get the ticket price. So, at the moment, somebody who is putting little weight on the aircraft (themselves+luggage) is effectively subsidising those who are putting lots of weight on the aircraft. But I can also see that an airline requires clarity on ticket prices. People will want to know when they book their package holiday or flight how much it will cost. Or do they ? Is it just that people are used to the fixed pricing. After-all, when I drive somewhere I don't know in advance what the cost will be (fuel costs vary with speed, distance, diversions, traffic jams, etc.).

So to me, on the face of it I consider it a good idea (not from a selfish perspective as I am probably average weight so would probably still be paying average rates), but from a fairness perspective. But I am only really aware of the aspects and considerations in various articles (e.g. the above) and my own thoughts - and I'm sure there are many other considerations. But given the expected massive increases in fuel costs, I would expect flight tickets to increase in price over the coming years so maybe we might see a shake-up of ticket pricing, maybe starting with domestic short haul flights, etc. ?

I read the story about Samoa Airlines introducing this policy.

They are flying very small planes,where the weight of the passengers makes a big difference in total fuel costs.

Personally i have my doubts that it is 'fair'...for example,tall people usually weigh more than short ones..and they can't do much about it! Pregnant women weigh more than the average too...should they have to pay much higher ticket prices?

I also have my doubts on how workable it is.The Samoan scheme involves telling them your weight when you book the ticket.Are they going to weigh everyone again before they get on the plane and make them pay more if their weight has gone up? Or refund them if it has gone down?

To expand my own opinions a bit, I think it is inherently fair to charge customers (passengers/goods) based on the airlines own cost structure.

Clearly, for a flight the airline will have some fixed costs and some variable costs (e.g. check-in, aircraft, pilot, etc. costs the same whatever the weight of passengers and luggage. Fuel not so and those costs apparently vary by the weight you have to keep in the sky.

So it probably depends on what portion of the costs are based on weight. It would probably cost the airlines more if they were charging an obese passenger an extra 25p on a flight London to Sydney. But probably worthwhile if the cost would be e.g. £50.
It is not the job of airlines to be fair. Their job is to make profits for their shareholders. I would suggest that maybe "fair" would be to charge based on BMI - which will never happen.

But is it fair that I pay more post a 5Kg than a 1Kg package ? Same applies to airlines carrying extra 20Kg weight (per passenger). If aircraft fuel is a significant portion of the cost, is it fair that lighter people subsidise the obese ?

A lot depends on the weight related costs in relation to the weight unrelated costs. But often people can be too quick to start screaming "discriminatory" when there are aspects of "discrimination" either way (we could say the current system discriminated against lighter people who subsidise those who are heavier).

That said, I am (as always) not fixed in my opinions and welcome other aspects (and facts).

You can choose how much to post...or how much baggage to carry.

You can't choose to cut your height from 2 metres to 1.65 ;-)

IMHO the airlines would charge shorter/thinner passengers the same as before...and charge heavier ones more,I don't think there will be any 'winners' here! And afaik this charge is only to be made by small airlines,with small planes,on short distance flights.

Maybe some fatter/bulkier passengers will choose to travel less...if they have that choice (for business etc. they may not).

Then...where does it stop?

Heavier people should pay more for taxis,buses etc?...same argument on fuel as on planes...

Tall people should pay more at the cinema..as they have a better view than the rest of us?

maybe they could have an average weight for a certain height. If you're 6ft2..then your average weight of 200 lbs is within the range..anything over..wham! $$ per pound !

When I get on a plane and walk down the aisle and see my seat and then look one over and see my row mate oozing over ..I know that its going to be a miserable ride. He/she is going to hog the armrest and if I persist I will have an elbow in my side. Everytime they turn a page I'll have to take action to stop from being poked and prodded. So its not them that is being discriminated against its us that end up miserable. My theory is that they have a Fat Zone. 1st class followed by business class followed by coach followed by the Fat Zone... 6 rows of seats where chubbies can sit and tick each off and rub sides.

But this policy of Samoa airlines wouldn't make any difference to you marichel....the huge person next to to you would still be there.They would stilll be encroaching into your space.They would just be paying more for the privilege.

Your idea would be better I think,,,say 2 seats side by side instead of 3...like a 'first class' section for the size-challenged individual.

Anyone over a certain weight could be seated there.

Presumably they would have to pay more for the seat.......

No Lucapal, In my world they will be in the Fat Zone. I don't have a lot of time for PC terms, Size-Challenged ! You're either Fat or Obese. Sugar coating terms just gives people license to eat yet another 1000 calories a day and blame it on something other then their lack of self discipline.

What happens if you lose/gain say 10kg between your buying the ticket and flying?

How is this policy going to be checked at the airport?

In principle it sounds ok but in reality it will add additional costs to all customers as these extra admin tasks won't come for free...

of course its ridiculous ! let the airlines sort it out. They have been dancing around the 'you're too fat for that seat' issue for some years now.

Good information...thank u for sharing.

If I arrive at the airport with too much luggage I have to pay an unknown amount (or I weigh before and find rates). Same applies if I buy loads of heavy stuff whilst away (where I might not even have access to scales).

I see the "mechanics" of charging pretty straightforward. I'm sure there are many solutions but e.g. you have a base ticket price plus a weight charge (based on everything of yours on-board, luggage plus yourself). When you book your ticket you could have the option to pre-pay the weight component (based on your stated weight) that might be subject to extra charge/refund when you fly if things have changed.

I think people have just got very used to paying by the seat with airlines that they find t difficult to perceive of anything different. But there are other forms of transport where you have no idea what your journey will cost even when you board your conveyance (e.g. taxi across London). But in those, people are used to variable costs and don't question it.

{quote:title=lucapal wrote:}{quote}
Then...where does it stop?

Heavier people should pay more for taxis,buses etc?...same argument on fuel as on planes...

Tall people should pay more at the cinema..as they have a better view than the rest of us?

I think in the case of buses and taxis, the cost for the operator does not vary according to how heavy somebody is so there is not the same justification. Same in cinemas - it costs the cinema the same to screen the film irrespective of the people viewing it (tall/short/heavy/light). It does seem to me that basing the ticket cost on the operators costs is fair - so you cause the operator higher costs (through your weight or your luggage weight) then you pay more for your ticket.

Of course the cost varies....if the load is heavier,you need more fuel to move.A plane,a car,a bus....even a camel needs to eat more if it has to carry a 'size challenged'' individual!

Marichel, I wish you were in charge of the airlines, I love your idea for the Fat Zone!

The Samoan Airlines story was all over the papers and talkback radio here in NZ with such a huge (excuse the pun) number living here. [Heres|http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10875041] an example why they're seriously considering it. And they are talking of fat seats to accommodate.

And here on Planet USA it was on the morning show CBS and went directly to the discrimination aspect of it, with consumers interviewed saying its discrimination because you can't help the way you are/look/weigh. At that point I changed the channel.

'When emotion comes in the door, logic goes out the window.'

That's a saying I have long beleived in. It is impossible for an emotional person to discuss something logically. Clearly, obese people cost more in fuel and clearly they impact other travellers due to their size vs. the size of a seat. Those are facts and not arguable.

To say it is discrimination is also true. So what? We discriminate every day. No one argues that it is discriminationt to charge for excess luggage. But in fact the airline is discriminating against the passenger who packs more stuff. Discrimination as and of itself is not necessarily a bad thing. Things do differ and so discrimination is normal, acceptable and inevitable.

The issue of obese people on planes has always been an issue. The only argument against charging them more has always been 'discrimination'. The assumption is that discrimination is UNFAIR. Define fair. Is it fair to the person sitting next to them to have to suffer?

It's like a criminal who has 'human rights'. The vicitim's rights however are often overlooked. I'm not suggesting being obese is a crime but being the victim who sits next to them is being a victim. So yes, a 'fat section' makes perfect sense to me. We NEED to discriminate for the good of all passengers. Isn't that what law is supposed to be about? You don't get to speed just because you want to. Why should you get to take up MY space?