to do annapurna or not?

Sorry if this post is repetitive, I've been glancing through some posts and haven't found the answer to some of my questions. I am going to Nepal this October and I know that this is the peak time to be going. So far, I think that I am most interested in the annupurna circuit (the first part, I've been told that there is the upper circuit and lower circuit, the upper circuit being 10 days.) But, I know that there will be lots of people, which I am not too keen on. So, some questions.

1) do I need to worry about not finding tea houses to stay in considering the season?

2) would you know of other trails that are similar, but would have less people? Annapurna seems to be the most popular trail, so it must be absolutely stunning. Is it worth the trade off of having tons of people?

3) would I need to bring any cooking supplies? Or just clothes and sleeping bag?

4) Do tea houses have electricity (to plug in my camera or should I use batteries)

5) I think this question has been asked before? Would you recommend just a guide? Just a porter? Guide and porter? Or none. What is a standard price these days, and are you the one that covers insurance, food, and tea house costs for them?

6) Do they limit how many people go on the trails. I will arive at the beginning of October. Would I have to wait a couple of weeks before I can get my trekking permit?

Thanks a whole bunch.

Carolyn

There is no upper/lower trails. Annapurna Sanctuary trek takes about 8 days, Annapurna Cirquit 18 days.

1) No, there are a lot of them. There is always a place somewhere.
2) Open areas (need no trekking permit & agency at the moment, see below) are Annapurna, Langtang & Helambu and Khumbu (Everest). Annapurna & Khumbu are most loaded with trekkers, but even them are not all that bad compared to some US parks for example. They also have the best facilities for independent trekkers.
3) Just clothes (also warm ones) and a fairly good sleeping bag.
4) Some do, you can recharge batteries at least every other day or so. Still better to take extra ones.
5) This is a large question. If you can carry your own pack you can get by without a porter. For a first timer a guide is nice to have. Guide costs about 15 USD and porter 7-10 USD/day and for that price they are supposed to pay their own food.
6) On these open areas there are no limitations. In about a month a new TRC (Trekking Registration Certificate) system will be in effect, which means that all trekkers must at least register using a trekking agency. We still do no know for sure if this also means that trekking without a guide becomes impossible.

Hi

I did the Circuit in 15 days (with 1 day rest)

1) There are teahouses everywhere so you will always find a place to stay. The people quickest at getting to the teahouses get the best rooms/beds. (It can get quite competitive up there)

2) Yes there are lots of people, but it's not like they are all in 1 place at any one time, except at the teahouses. Trekkers are ususally pretty spread out, so it doesn't detract from the enjoyment or the stunning views. I've done Everest Base Camp, and trekked in Northern India, and the Patagonian and Peruvian Andes. The Annapurna trek - in my opinion - is still one of the most stunning treks ever!!

3) No supplies needed. You are always provided with a blanket (even if it can be quite smelly). I took a 3 season sleeping bag with me and I used it underneath the blanket they provided at the teahouse.

4) I can't remember any plugs, but I didn't need them. I believe a few of the bigger villages have electricity and plugs in the larger hostels.

5) No guide/porter needed. The trail is practically paved it's so well-trodden!!

6) Yes, you need a permit.

I have few questions, please:

1. Is the bottled water available in the tea houses. I don't want to carry a water filter, which is extra weight.

2. How about lunch. Is it also available in the tea houses OR we need to pack ahead. Are the tea houses located at only a day's trek apart, OR also, inbetween.

3. If doing solo with a trail map, are the trails well marked with signs.

4. Should I do it in September or wait until October 1st?

5. I will be carrying my own sleeping bag. Do I need to carry a camping mattress, too?

6. Also, how often one gets to shower on this Annapurna Circuit Trek?

7. How difficult/easy it is to hookup with other trekkers on this Annapurna Circuit Trek?

8. Annapurna Circuit Trek seems to be one of the spectacular and more popular treks in the whole world. I am looking for daily trek elevation gain, elevation drop and the distance chart. I could not find it anywhere. Elevation gain/drop gives an estimate of the effort involved in the trek. Where can I find this?

Thanks in advance.

In reply to Post #3

1) Yes. But it is not environmentally friendly to keep on buying bottled water. Where do you think they put the plastic bottles after you have finished with them?? Best thing is to use one bottle and use local water, then either use iodine, or chlorine tablets. Or the best option is to get the teahouse to boil up a couple of litres of water and buy a 2L water bladder (available in outdoor stores).

2) food is available the whole way

3) As mentioned before, this trail is practically paved its so well trodden. No map is neccessary (but is informative if you are interested in your surroundings)

4) September is the very beginning of the trekking season and is ALOT quieter than October

5) Camping mattress is not neccessary as there is always a bed available.

6) Not often. I can't remember many shower facilities (maybe 1 or 2). Most teahouses will give you a few hot buckets (some charge for this)

7) Very easy.

8) Buy the Trekking in the Nepal Himalayas by the Lonely Planet. The entire trek is described in terms of elevation gains/drops, walking hours per day, villages......basically everything you need to know.

Also,

1) ACAP have water filtration stations along the way where you can refill your water bottle as well. Don't buy bottled water as #4 says it's a huge environmental problem now. Boiled water is easy to buy on route. If you do take a filter, use a piece of cotton cloth to pre filter if using the tap water. Mine was bunged solid with rust from the water tanks after a few days.

3) Only time you might have a problem is if there is a fresh heavy snowfall before heading over Thorung La. Unlikely in October, but if it happens be careful.

6) Showers? If you don't mind cold showers then most days, unless you're staying at very basic teahouses. The bucket of warm water is better.

7) Yes, very easy, also advisable before heading over the pass.

8) Also lots & lots of online descriptions of the trek try yeti zone for starters.

Enjoy it's a fantastic trek, and one of the easiest to do independantly.

dodgem and mrs jones: Thanks a bunch for your quick replies. The yeti zone web-site is very helpful.

I was counting on bottled water as I didn't want to get an upset stomach. Boiled water should be fine, I guess. It is comforting to know that food is available all the way, in which case I would just carry some energy bars and dried fruit for emergencies.

1. Looks like, day 10, Thorang Phedi to Muktinath via Thorong La (750m elevation gain/ 1500m elevation loss) seems to be the challenging of all the days. I have seen pictures (on yeti zone) of Thorang La in snow. What should one do in snow conditions (Sep/ Oct); just waitout or walk in snow carefully?

2. If I am taking thermals (top and bottom), should I be taking light weight or medium or heavy weight?

3. Apart from basic first-aid kit what special medications are required for this elevation.

4. Can I wear cotton tshirts or totally avoid cotton and just take Tech Wear only?

(more questions later)

Thanks again,

Wow, two different posters here. #3, it helps to start you own post so the orginal poster doesn't feel hijacked. Melocaro, you received a couple time frames to trek the Annapurna Circuit. You certainly can run around it in 14 or 15 days, but I wonder why you'd want to do that. The area is so beautiful and there are so many side trips that you can do, I'd recommend taking more time. I took 22 days and you could easily take more. It's a real special place so I suggest you take your time and enjoy the Nepali culture along the way unless you're into trail running. You certainly don't need a guide, guide/porter, or porter to show you the way. As others have pointed out, the trail is pretty obvious for the most part. However, a guide or guide/porter can explain the culture, vegetation, mountains, and introduce you to other Nepali's along the way, if you are into that. When I did this trek in 2004, our guide/porter would take us on some interesting side trails that just weren't used by the tourists. It was a wonderful opportunity to get off the main trail and see some areas that most trekkers just didn't see. If you decide you want a guide, please make clear what you expect from them before you hire them. #1 provided some reasonable costs for a guide and porter. You can purchase package deals that will include all your food and lodging costs (except certain expenses like alcohol, perhaps a limit on soft drinks, etc,) or you can pay for your guide on a per day basis. You pay for your own lodging and food (very inexpensive) and they pay for there's.

#3, I prefer to carry a light weight water filter and some chlorine or iodine tabs. It's just not that heavy and it's a lot more environmentally responsible. Buying plastic bottles just contributes to waste piles that others have pointed out. I certainly support # 5's suggestion to use the ACAP water filtration systems. It's a great program and I urge everyone to help support it. In 2004, however, it couldn't meet all your water needs. Boiling water takes a lot of energy. I prefer to conserve it, especially if the teahouse is using wood as a fuel. There's just been too much deforestation in Nepal over the last couple of decades. You can do your part by not asking for boiled water unless you're drinking it as tea on the spot. Water filtering is so easy. I carry an MSR Sweetwater microfilter that weighs 10 ounces ( 285 grams). Get a filter that is field cleanable so your filter will still work (after it's cleaned) if you run into the issues the # 5 described. I never ran into such issues.
# 3, some of your other questions from post 6:

1. It just depends on how much snow you're talking about. You may have to wait it out a day or two or walk carefully in the snow if it's not much and others are doing it. You just have to assess the situation as it comes up.
2. Take layers of clothing so you can add and subtract them as conditions change.
3. Some people use Diamox. See this link. Also, take something for headaches. A decongestant is also recommended if you get a head cold. A general purpose antibiotic is helpful if you get a sinus or other infection.
4. I take a cotton tshirt or two for lower elevations. At higher elevations or if the weather turns cold or wet, cotton will just chill you. Have something else for these conditions.

I walked the entire circuit and into the sanctuary in late march/early April this year - and except at a few of the higher altitude lodges (eg. in the Sanctuary and thorung phedi & high camp) and I had a warm-to-hot shower almost every day. Most lodges had solar showers and were not charging any extra for their guests.

Thanks for your replies.

I feel relieved to know that I don't have to worry about accomodations and that I don't have to bring cooking supplies. I was looking at my book where I got the information and I know why I was confused. My book separated the circuit into the Northern and Southern part, but I thought that they were two separate treks. So now I'm also wondering about the Sanctuary trek. Has anyone been there? Or does anyone kow of a great web site that describes it. What are the main differences between the two treks?

I'm in Nepal for 5 weeks and definately want to have some time to visit Katmandu and the neighbouring three towns as well.

Thanks again.

I found good info on www.yetizone.com<BR><BR>Enjoy - it's a wonderful trek.

hey melo-- my boyfriend and I are arriving Sept 20th, and will hang in KTM for a week or so getting supplies and sightseeing. We are going sans guide and sans porter, and at first doing the Annapurna circuit trek. Not sure if you want company or not, but you can check our website www.daijalovestroy.blogspot.com and my myspace site www.myspace.com/daijarillera and see if you'd like to meet.

We are in good shape ( I ran a marathon last fall) though have never trekked before. We are laid back, outdoorsy, and would be up for someone else to walk with--

PM me if interested

Thanks to all and esp. tomtraveller.

I keep hearing tea houses and tea. I'm more of a coffee guy and was wondering whether they serve coffee, too?

How are the toilets? are they pit-toilets or chemical ones? Thanks again.

#12, many tea houses/hotels will sell coffee although it costs alot more. I'm not a coffee guy so I can't tell you about its quality. Toilets are usually pit. Most will have a concrete floor with small hole. You'll use water from a bucket to wash it down the hole. At higher elevations, when ice covers the floor, it's very tricky to squat over the hole! Others have a much bigger hole where you can actually look into the pit. For these, just don't go to the hole drunk. You'd hate to fall in! Occasionally, you'll find a western toilet where you can actually sit.

lol, tomtraveller. You know, I actually prefer squatters, since as a woman it's much easier to squat over a hole than over a toilet seat.

Anyways, visceral trek, I don't think we'll be overlapping each other. Since I probably won't be starting the trek until the 20th of October. Thanks though, and have wonderful time?

Still looking for information between the circuit and the sanctuary trail,and their main differences...all I seem to find on the net, are maps.

Carolyn: check out this thread Stilltrekkin provides a good brief description of the differences. The Jomsom trek is simply the east side of the Annapurna. You can always combine the two (AC & AS) as described in yetizone

Thank you so much tom traveller

Is the Annapurna base camp trek considered the same as the Sanctuary trek? I was looking at the maps and they seem to be the same.

yes, they are the same. Above, I said the Jomsom trek was the east side of the Annapurna Circuit (AC) trek. Sorry if I confused you. It's the west side of the AC.

Thanks to all for invaluable advise. Since there are so many experts here, I thought I will post my packing list for the AC trek in Oct 06. Please feel free to comment/suggest add/ delete. Thanks in advance.

Passport with trekking permit; take a bunch of passport photos;
Backpack; and Pack Cover;
Sleeping Bag in its bag;
Sleeping Bag Liner - Silk Liner- Cocoon?;
2 Wool Socks; 2 Sock-Liners;
Polartec Jacket; Also useful as pillow;
Medium Weight Thermals; Top and bottom;
Warm Hat, Gloves, Scarf;
Rain Jacket and Rain pants;
3 T-shirts (One of them is longsleeve) All Techwick;
2 pair convertible pants;
3 Techwick briefs/boxers;
Bandana;

Two trekking poles;
Lighter;
Small Towel;
Map - tear out relavent Guide Book; Notepad for notes; Pencil;
Whistle; Compass;

First-aid kit with Diamox and Dexamethasone; painkillers and Moleskins;
Flip-Flops or Sneakers;
Sun Hat; Sunglasses; Eye-glasses;
Small soap; Portable razor; Shampoo;
Toilet Paper - spare little only;
Tooth Paste Dental Floss;
Moisturizing Cream;
Camera + extra-batteries + Charger;
Head lamp Petzl Tikka; extra batteries;
Swiss Army Knife with Scissors;

2 Water Bottles; Iodine tabs Hi-C vitamin tabs; Gatorade Powder;
Dried Cherries; Almonds; Pistachios; Granola Bars;
Hot Sauce; Instant Coffee;

Fairly good list. I would not bother with pack cover and rain pants, getting serious rain is not a big possibility, just pack sleeping bag & clothes in plastic bags. Two pairs of convertible pants, why? Replace one pair with powerstretch legginses. 3-4 pairs of liner socks, then you can chance liners even during the day and still have a dry, clean pair for the evening. I would also take either a down vest or a light down jacket.

especially if your trekking pants are water repellent & fast drying. If there is high wind in Thorong La layer thremals, powerstetch & trekking pants.

RE: 20

Thanks Petrus. I thought pack cover would be useful to save my down sleeping bag from rain. Packing in plastic bags is not a bad idea. As you suggested, I would drop the 2nd pair of convertible pants which would definitely save some weight. Yes, the pants are fast drying nylon. You mentioned powerstretch legginses, which I understand are synthetic long johns or thermals? right? Yes, I am carrying carrying thermals. I some how avoided cotton, totally -- except as bandanas and towel.

I have decided to do this trek in mid October, instead of mid-September as several people suggested that it could be cloudy in Sep. October, I understand has good views and also lots of crowds.
T h a n k s A g a i n.

Couple of more questions:

What is Dal Bhat -- the food served at the teahouses. Is it Dal and Rice or Dal and Bread; also, is it nutrional (strength) enough to do the trekking next day.

Is it possible to leave my other baggage in my hotel in Kathmandu and do the trek and come back and collect it? Thanks again.

bhat means rice, additionally there will be pickles, veg curry or meat curry (u choose at order), sometimes curd - but will get less variety the higher u come

i always found it a great diet, never eat anything else there (this fancy western food on the menu doesn't taste well, u have to wait long...)
dal bhat is usually - after this anapurna conservation area project - available for the same price in each restaurant in a village, but again the higher u come the more expensive it will be... like all food

u can leave luggage at hotel, good ones offer a nice locker, sometimes for free. u can even leave it in pokhara if u don'T go from KTM straight to Besisahar

snow on thorong la is great, i passed it in nov. 06 after the terrible snowfalls - but in good weather again, clear blue sky, fascinating view...

we got up late, didn't join the run for the very fisrt morning hours to start, starting only after 8, slowly reaching the top between 12 and 1pm. for going down this means, that there will be a slight water film on the snow as it starts melting a little bit (only if there is a thick snow layer below)
i just sat down and did the better part of the path on my bottom - intentionally, great time! but take care

and to the coffee topic: as far as i know (i am also the tea type) there is only nescafe. maybe in manang or jomsom they have a really coffee machine, but i don't know confirmed...

have fun!!!

Is it easy to buy these medications in Kathmandu: Diamox and Dexamethasone

Also, can someone suggest a place to stay in Kathmandu, which also near to get the permits.

Thanks again.

bumping this great thread in hopes that others will see and add to it.