Need help from the forum

Here is the deal. I am looking for a new challenge, a new life, a new adventure. I am an educated guy in my early forties and am golden handcuffed to a horrible life-sucking job that pays really well (think pharma). I am married, with mortgage, no kids, a cat and not enough money to retire. My wife is wonderful and would leave her job (so she says) and we can do whatever would make me happy. The question I struggle with is: What would make me happy.
I love to travel (been to 20+ countries) and can do so on a shoe-string. But what do you do that you find meaning in? I wonder if I am just fantasizing about running off into the world as a reactionary measure to all the BS of the rat race or if it is real. What do guys think? Midlife crisis?
Have you dealt with these feelings? If so I would love to hear some stories/encouragement/advice.
Thanks.
I know this is not a psych forum but travel is where I can relate.

Well, i kinda done just what you are thinking about.

I left my well paid job, got my backpack on and off i went with just a pocketfull of Euros.

9 years later, i am still traveling, and i have a completely mobile business. All i need is my laptop and an internet connection.
I travel constantly, visiting, experiencing and living in whatever country i like.
It's a nomadic lifestyle, to be free from those corporate chains, and to just find what you like.

That's the key, and sometimes you just have to head off into the sunset to find what it is that you like.

Well, I think it is good that you are thinking about what would actually make you happy before you throw it all in on the assumption that travel is the key.

Sadly I obviously have no idea what would make you happy.

#1s advice obviously worked out for him but I wouldn't necessarily recommend it. A completely mobile business requires certain skill sets. I know I for one don't have them. If you do, by all means explore this avenue.

For me I worked out in my 20s that I needed a job, not a career. I went back to university and trained as a teacher. Now I have a job that I enjoy and that allows me to live in different countries along with plenty of holidays to enjoy travelling. But I'm still tied to working and I still can't just up and go whenever I want. So I guess I have handcuffs too (although not golden one, cheap alloy at best).

You don't say where you're from but is it possible you could take a career break and do something like the Peace Corp?

I understand this may sound trite, but have you considered the possibility that you might be depressed? Even if you are not depressed, you might find it beneficial talking to a counselor to try to figure out what would make your life better. I would be concerned that there is no geographic cure, that a new challenge, a new life, a new adventure is only new for a short period of time an then you are back to searching for something that makes you feel good.

Ruth

At the risk of sounding over cautionary, I back the words of warning of #2 and 3. A 'soul sucking job' obviously is a bad situation, and it's great you're exploring your options, but I believe it's important to have a motivation greater than just running away from a bad job. As Ruth says, otherwise you're risking soon being in exactly the same situation, though now far from home and possibly with even less options. I posted here once about how surprised I was that, despite moving half way around the world, the fundamentals of my life did not change. And it was on this forum that I learned the phrase 'there is no geographic cure'. That all being said, leaving the States was a good move for us, but we left to create a business that we'd been planning for, and to a country that we'd known for years that we needed to be a part of.

Work while constantly traveling is difficult for most people. #1 has made a success of it, but I'd wager he had to work hard to make it so. The real key to his success is probably that he likes what he does, otherwise it would be a life sucking job for him as well. Also, as #2 points out, mobility requires a certain set of skills. You might do well to make a list of all that you are trained to do and evaluate those skills for their portability. With a pharma background you might consider consulting or contract work with the pharma industry's expansion into emerging markets. This would require a lot of networking to ensure a viable business. On the other hand, it may give you the control over your life that you seem to be looking for, plus the chance to work in a variety of other countries.

Good luck

#2 Peace Corp? You don't reccomend a business, but you reccomend the peace corp?
#3 Depression?

OP wants to hear stories of encouragment and Advice, not this bs, i should imagine!

OP, think out of the box, go ahead and do something exciting, something new that you have never done, something that you have always wanted to do.

Take a 3 month break, a trial. That is the safest way. Then you have 3 months to travel and investigate the possibility of a new life and what it can offer you and your wife.

After the 3 months, return to your usual life, then compare, see what you like best.

It's no risk. You still have your house, your job and both ou and your wife will either be heading off in a new direction or realising that you are happy with everything you have.

I done this recently with a friend. He joined me on my travels for 3 months, to work things out for himself. To find what he needed in life.... did he need a complete change? did he just need a break? what would happen if he had a complete change? What would he feel like? Would he MISS his existing life?

He went back home buzzing about his new opportunities. Suddenly he could see exactly where he should be heading in life.
That's all it took.

He found what would make him happy by doing something random for a while, a 3 month, no risk trial.

OP wants to hear stories of encouragment and Advice, not this bs, i should imagine!

Encouragement is not sensible if OP is depressed and not getting the help that he needs.

Realistic advise is what is needed, not overly optimistic reports of one or two people simply taking a trip and finding themselves.

Four people have posted and three recommend caution. I think your suggestions are the ones that need to be taken with a grain of salt.

OP - As someone who has a job that requires lots of travel, I can tell you that I get up every morning, shower, eat breakfast and go to work, whether it is in the coutnry in which I reside, or one that I am visiting for business. It doesn't matter.

Travel may be something that you love, but it is not the same as living overseas and VERY few jobs permit travel on a regular basis. Mine does but it still doesn't permit me to do much site seeing when I do travel.

I strongly encourage you to reaad through some of the other posts on this branch. You will quickly see that there are a small group of people who will encourage you to simply take off and do whatever you want. There is another larger group that will offer more carefully worded encouragement to take a long hard look at what you are hoping to accomplish.

If you are looking to retire and spend the rest of your days traveling, then figure out how to cut your expenses and save every penny so that you can acheive your goal. But think carefully because something has caused you to make the decisions that you have made thus far in life to reach the point of being in my early forties and am golden handcuffed to a horrible life-sucking job that pays really well (think pharma). I am married, with mortgage, no kids, a cat and not enough money to retire.

Ruth

I'm really getting quite sick of people on this forum who choose to make assumptions.

Assumptions that the OP is depressed, when nobody has any idea who the OP is and when nobody on this forum is qualified and experienced to make a possible diagnosis of depression or any other medical condition.

Just because somebody has an idea that they might want to change their life, everybody jumps on the " your'e depressed" bandwagon.

Don't talk absolute poppycock when you have no idea whatsover about people's personal circumstances.

everbrite, you have a job, a career which means you have to travel.
You can bring good to this conversation with advice on what you found helpful with what you do and the difficulties that you experienced in doing what you do.

But to make assumptions about people is not on.

It is so amazing that people come to this forum for TRAVEL advice and end up being diagnosed as depressed by a bunch of couch doctors.

I apologise to the OP for all the hatred and name calling he has experienced here.
But can tell him this is, unfortunately, historically typical of the thorntree.

Let me add myself as the fourth voice of caution and reason versus the lone loudmouth who advises jumping off a cliff. But too many people who come to this branch purportedly looking for advice simply want to be told what they want to hear and will shoot the messenger for anything they criticize as "negativity". I hope that the OP is not one of them and can listen to reason.

What I do get tired of are people like #1. Those who do nothing but tell people to throw caution to the wind because that is "negativity." It's a constant struggle here with these types but guess what. We win out in the end. Just look at the post numbers of the people who advise caution. We've been around here a long time. We last because our lifestyles are sustainable. People who make unreasonable and rash decisions tend to drop out one way or another. Even those whose careers are sustainable find that their lifestyles aren't. Those who lead a nomadic life like #1 often are lonely. They are everywhere but also nowhere. They don't build a "life" and often can't because the visa situation doesn't allow them long term stays. That is one reason why they love to brag about how great their lives and careers are; because they are also trying to convince themselves of that. Would I want a life and career like that? Not in a million years, but then that is my personal opinion.

Fifth voice of caution here.

Ruth raises legitimate questions, based on the OP ("horrible life-sucking job", "Midlife crisis?", etc.). Travel is not a magic solution for life's problems. No one is assuming or diagnosing, only asking questions.

--Greg

LOL

I don't believe that the "cautious" posters have read my post properly.

What i suggested was a 3 month test, a break, a get away from it all, time for reflection.

I'm talking from real experience of this situation, as i noted earlier, regarding one of my friends who was in a similar situation to the OP.

If that is do-able, at no risk to the OP ( if he can still retain his work position) it is a perfect solution for someone to try to find what is going to make them happy.

In the end, that person may decide that they actually love their present life, and just undervalued what they had. and on the other hand, they might find that a change is indeed needed.

Additionally, please note that i have NEVER told anyone to just throw caution to the wind and just go off and do something.
If you re-read my posts properly, i responded to the OP's request for personal experiences and suggested that he TRY something.

Sometimes people don't want others to have these opportunities because they cannot bear the thought that others will have a better opportunity at being happy than themselves.

Me, personally, i am very happy, never lonely, because i have my partner, i have a successful business, and can choose to set down roots again at any time i wish, any country i wish, or i can just continue experiencing as much of this beautiful world as i possibly can.

Right, now back to that balcony and that beach.

You sound like a couple of teenagers arguing at the beach. For goodness sake, make up and be friends!

OP, I hope you learned something from this spat:)

Ok I'd like to chip in with a positive note. You say you have no kids. This is the #1 reason that most people don't travel, for fear of disturbing schooling etc. You don't have this problem. You have a house. You can rent this out whilst testing out your new lifestyle. Then you still have a house to come back to later. If your job pays well I guess you don't stack shelves in your local supermarket. If you have a good education & good experiance it might not be too hard to find a replacement job in 6 months or so. Why don't you apply for jobs like yours & see what responce you get. Then you will know what chance you have of getting another well paid job again.

ricky:

I'm assuming you are not a native English speaker based both on your poor spelling and your seemingly weak comprehension skills. So, let me help you out a little.

Nowhere did I

don't reccomend a business

I simply pointed out that not everyone has the skill set necessary to do what you were advocating. In fact I even said that if he did have a skill set that would allow a mobile business he should investigate it.

Assumptions that the OP is depressed, when nobody has any idea who the OP is and when nobody on this forum is qualified and experienced to make a possible diagnosis of depression or any other medical condition.

There was no assumption that the OP was depressed. It was simply mentioned as a possibility for the OP to consider. He was the one who mentioned midlife crisis. The assumption seems to be yours when you say that nobody on this forum is qualified or experienced in making such a diagnosis. I'm pretty sure you'll find that at least one of the people posting has all the necessary qualifications.

Just because somebody has an idea that they might want to change their life, everybody jumps on the " your'e depressed" bandwagon.

Out of curiousity did you try counting (hint, you'll only need to use one hand) exactly how many people jumped on the 'you're depressed' bandwagon (note spelling of the word you're for future reference)? I'm wondering how you extrapolated that number to 'everybody'.

I apologise to the OP for all the hatred and name calling he has experienced here.

It is kind of you to want to apologise to the OP. If his reading skills are anything like mine it might be helpful if you give him some clues as to where this name calling has actually happened. Because I don't see any. And the only 'hatred' seems to be from you, directed at those of us who replied with different opinions to your own.

can choose to set down roots again at any time i wish, any country i wish

Statements like that clearly flag that you are just bullshitting. No one can choose to set down roots in 'any country they wish' unless of course they only plan to 'wish' for a very narrow range of countries. Are you not familiar with the concept of the visa? I'm wondering if you've travelled much at all.

OP I'm afraid this kind of wrangling is rather typical of what happens on this branch. You'll find many of us who do either live overseas or travel a lot for work (or a combination of the two) who love the lifestyle and yet manage to be realistic about what it entails. We're the ones who stick around here long term offering advice and suggestions and sharing our own stories. Then you'll find people like ricky who are full of 'piss and wind' and accuse anyone who disagrees with them of being old stick in the muds.

Good luck in figuring out what you want to do. You have a lot going for you and personally I think it is great you are considering escaping those golden handcuffs.

Edited by: purpletreefrog

"Well, i kinda done just what you are thinking about.
I left my well paid job, got my backpack on and off i went with just a pocketfull of Euros.
9 years later, i am still traveling, and i have a completely mobile business. All i need is my laptop and an internet connection.
I travel constantly, visiting, experiencing and living in whatever country i like.
It's a nomadic lifestyle, to be free from those corporate chains, and to just find what you like.
That's the key, and sometimes you just have to head off into the sunset to find what it is that you like."

Please tell me, where in that quoted text, which is my original response, did i tell OP what to do?
So, your assumptions are doubly wrong....firstly for assuming that i reccomended OP to go start a mobile business, and secondly, for assuming that OP has the skillset to do that.

Again, here, you see that you were the first person to ever mention assumption in this thread.

the act of assuming or taking for granted; "your assumption that I would agree was unwarranted" - an example of the word assumption.

A word of advice, if you are going to criticise other people, please ensure that you, yourself do not make mistakes.
Because then, that is when your assumptions become arrogant...

arrogance - overbearing pride evidenced by a superior manner toward inferiors
#1s advice obviously worked out for him but I wouldn't necessarily recommend it." = arrogance

There is no need to correct my spelling or to correct my comprehension.
In fact, if you read the rules of the forum, this behaviour is specifically banned.

"Statements like that clearly flag that you are just bullshitting. No one can choose to set down roots in 'any country they wish' unless of course they only plan to 'wish' for a very narrow range of countries. Are you not familiar with the concept of the visa? I'm wondering if you've travelled much at all." = arrogance, assuming that i am not telling the truth, when the truth is, you have absolutely know idea who i am, what i do, where i am, where i have travelled over the past 9 years.
Yes, i , aswell as most other normal people can choose to settle in any country they wish.
Of course, the obtaining of a visa is essential, but that is implied as a basic of the reality of travel.

"We're the ones who stick around here long term offering advice and suggestions and sharing our own stories. Then you'll find people like ricky who are full of 'piss and wind' and accuse anyone who disagrees with them of being old stick in the muds." = again, arrogance towards inferiors.

Yes, we both agree that this is typical of the Thorntree, not just this branch but the whole thorntree.
The BBC certainly didn't know what they were getting themselves into when they purchased the LP name.

Purpletreefrog, are you sure you are not Schizophrenic?

And for your convenience, here is the definition:

Schizophrenia ( or ) is a mental disorder characterized by abnormalities in the perception or expression of reality. It most commonly manifests as auditory hallucinations, paranoid or bizarre delusions, or disorganized speech and thinking with significant social or occupational dysfunction.

Remember: just because you teach maths, it doesn't make you smart.

It just makes you arrogant, and you have a big history of telling people that they have no comprehension, don't you?......

"You don't seem to have great comprehension. I'm not arguing with your data, I'm arguing with your use of the word 'our'. If you had said 'my society' it would have made more sense. "

"Websterella once again you might want to work on your comprehension skills. Either that or read what I actually say."

Oh look, there's a pattern forming here, a history, you certainly do have some mind issues.
One would question if you should be teaching kids at all with this proven attitude?

But sometimes, even you don't comprehend:

"They are a colleague who I get along perfectly well with it would be stupid to upset the apple cart by questioning a behaviour that caused me 5 minutes of surprise and in no way affects (or is it effects, I can never get those straight) my daily life."

"See no matter how many times people tell me things like that I don't 'get it'.
Either that or they'd uncover my crappy state school education. "

So, don't lecture fellow posters on their abilities in writing english please.

Crawl away into your classroom (if there really is one), look at the kids, and ask, how much of my arrogance is being perceived by these children? how will this affect them in their lives?

The truth is, you really don't know.

Well, to get back to the OP's original question...

Though I'm one of those posters who advised caution, #1's suggestion of a trial run is good. It's what we did. We left in the summer with the children enrolled in school for the next year, packed our suitcases and left, telling everyone we'd in all likelihood be back in a couple of months. I had earlier set up at work an online system that allowed our collaborators to share data, so I was able to convince the boss that I could also work remotely for the summer. After a few months we found that working remotely was effective, the business we hoped to establish had hopes, and a good life in our new chosen country was possible. This doesn't mean that after two months all problems were solved, it took months more to finalize visa problems, get funding for the business, etc. But it was long enough to convince us that solutions were possible. So we returned to the States long enough to get a manager to take care of the home, told the schools we wouldn't be back, picked up a few items we had found impossible to live without, and returned to our new 'home'.

That being said, the notes of caution that many have voiced here are important. The OP mentions dissatisfaction with their current life, a love of travel, and asks if there is a better path for them. A life of travel, or life in a another country, may not be the best solution. At least, it's is certainly not the central point of a solution. Moving to a new country will solve few problems, and working while traveling is hard. It's not a step to take blindly. On the other hand, living in new countries offers a host of rewards that I suspect a lot of us 'cautionary' posters really enjoy. We want others to enjoy this too.

Unfortunately I know many expatriates who are unhappy, or who create an expatriate shell around themselves trying very hard to recreate the trappings of their home country. I'm not knocking this approach, for people posted abroad for just a few years, or whose marriage to someone who's job brings them abroad, that approach can make sense. But it's a constant reminder that changing your location is not a panacea. The people that are happiest abroad- and there are many- seem to be those that genuinely enjoy their job or whatever lifestyle they created for themselves. Thus, they have the energy to explore their new surroundings and attempt to integrate. They are the ones that can use being abroad to its fullest potential.

And so thus, my words of caution, and I suspect there is similar reasoning behind others' prudence. I believe more people should travel and live abroad; like the old saying, it really can broaden the mind. But make this step knowing well the problems inherent in that lifestyle. Most importantly, do so knowing what makes you happy and with a plan that helps you find that happiness while abroad. These seemed to be the OP's questions, so he should be commended for beginning this exploration on the right footing.

Good luck.

If you have a burning desire to travel, then go for it. But if you are travelling because you kind of like it and are not sure what else you should be doing, then packing up and heading overseas for the long-haul is probably not a good idea.

I agree having a sabbatical to go travelling sounds like a good option. Maybe you could even sell the house so there are no financial ties or stresses.

What kind of pharmaceutical work do you do? Have you looked at other jobs on offer in other industries? Maybe NGO work?

I had a life altering experience in Morocco right around my 30th birthday. I went home, called the Salvation Army and donated my furniture,quit my (soul sucking) job, and traded in my new car and payments for a clunker that ran for awhile, but had no payments. Then the poodle and the parrot and I jumped into the car and drove north, no particular destination. The car broke down in a small, semi-ghost town, population 400. I found a job as a waitress in a mom and pop greasy spoon, the kind that gave away free soup to the town drunks, and got a room behind a bar.

Ok, that was pretty crazy, my friends and family were horrified. Looking back 30 years later, it was one of the best stupid things I've ever done.

I'm not suggesting doing anything that radical. It worked for me, though.

Ahhh how sweet. I've got a little internet stalker.

I feel kind of special.

hahaha, don't flatter yourself.

hi everyone!
I've only just joined so am a little reluctant to wade in, given that things seem to get a little, um.. heated! But, since pignmonkey originally mentioned looking for encouragement/ stories then I'm going to dip my toe in.

I'm currently sat on a balcony in Australia watching the sunset and drinking a beer. I probabaly do more than my fair share of such things, but my laptop is never far away, as this is where i run my UK based business from. In 2004 I was working full time in a well paid job (as a psychologist as it happens but let's not go into that!). But after a career break to go travelling i realised it was worth the gamble to try something different so I set up as a freelancer. Luckily I had my husband to pay the rent in the tricky months. To cut a long story short, with lots of hard work it started to earn me a living, to the point where my husband could quit his 9-5 to help me out. Without the normal ties of annual leave, the world opened up to us. We now travel 4 or 5 months of the year, working as we go. It hasnt been easy, but i woudln't say it is as hard as you might think either. So, no advice being offered but food for thought i hope.
Hannah

musilion that's an awesome story.
Why all the bitching? too much time on your hands guys!
loveplaywork - Freelancing as what?

hey mrjack
freelacing as an assessment and development consultant (kind of HR, selection stuff)- not very interesting to anyone else (luckily I quite like it though!). I think it is possible to take the skills you learn as an employee and apply them as a 'consultant', but then I would because I did it! But i've been doing it long enough now that I can kind of set the rules- I know i just need a desk and laptop to do the design work and my clients accept i won't be available for last minute meetings or unplanned phone calls!
Hannah

I have felt the same wonder lust periodically all my life and am about to head out looking for adventure leaving my already dreamlike lifestyle on the tropical beach of Boracay Island behind for 8 to 9 months this year and next year. It's normal for people to feel the effects of living a routine cushy but routine scheduled lifestyle day in and day out without any major events along the way. Luckily I didn't finish my education nor choose to get a job so basically have succeeded in escaping the 9 to 5 middleclass American lifestyle but it took blind faith focused on living life spontaneously.

Mate treat yourself and your lady on a great holliday notthing put pampering and relaxation not on the cheap spoil your self , if you have been doing hollidays on a shoe string you cant realy relax
relaxation is the key to better live do it with the one you love the better it is , we are all handcuffed to our job to a degree ,do go out more with your mates.. night out on the town or have friends come over for a dinner party live is all about livin it out site the job hr