Does anyone like Geneva?

hello,

I've been reading up a lot on Geneva and looking at various threads and most of the posts are quite negative- my question is, does anyone like Geneva? Or more accurately what do you like or not like about it?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm currently living in London and I hate it (bad weather- cliche but it's really depressing, horrible public transport -always delayed and really expensive, takes minimum of 45 mins to get anywhere, people are horribly rude often bordering on aggressive, etc). I'm Swiss/American and moved here about a year and a half ago. I'm looking to move somewhere else with my Spanish boyfriend (who also isn't a fan of London) and Geneva seems to be the place we've settled on for various reasons:
- we both have the right to work there
- we both speak french, though I understand a lot of jobs don't even require it
- it's a smaller city than London
- Spain's economy is crap so that's not really an option
- I work in the humanitarian sector and a lot of INGOs and IOs are based there

The point is that I'm set at this point on moving to Geneva in about 5/6 months and would like to hear from some people that are actually living there (or did so in the past). Just about the only complaint I've heard is that it's "boring," but what exactly does that mean? I have a pretty boring life in London- I work long hours, spend almost 2 hours every day on my commute, and get home so tired that I can't be bothered to go out... and if I wanted to then it would require another 45 minute trek out to meet anyone as everyone seems to live on the opposite side of the city. On the weekends I do go out walk around town, go to museums, go to shows, go for drinks/dinner, but not all that often. I think I'd rather live in a place that's smaller- and even if it has less to offer in terms of options for entertainment, maybe I'd actually be more likely to go to those few events because that's all there is, versus here where I often don't go out at all...

thanks!
d

Mercer's is an international consulting firm which publishes a "quality of LIving" survey. This is not just some other survey, it is used by almost every major company (and the UN) when deciding were to set up offices and how much to pay staff that gets sent there. For the last few year, there has been a rotating winner. It's either Vancouver, Zurich or Geneva In 2010, Geneva came in 3rd

I have been visiting Geneva regularly since 1996 and have very close friends who live there. As a city, there isn't much happening. It is pleasant but expensive. Public transport where I want to go is usually bus and generally pretty convenient though it can take 45 minutes or longer to get across town.

The weather is something that you need to consider. While perhaps it isn't as gray as London, it is cold. Winters are snow filled and below freezing. And summers tend to be relatively mild. If you like skiing in the winter and hiking in the summer, there are lots of nearby options.

There are several museums, occasional festivals on the Lake. One of the things that I like about it is that it is a nice base for lots of day and weekend trips to interesting places in CH and F.

Ruth

I've been to Geneva a few times, and I agree with #2. If you think London's weather is crap, Geneva's is not that much better and is colder in winter.

And looking at some climate charts, Geneva has almost twice as much rainfall as London in the summer, and significantly more precipitation in winter (although not sure how much of that is snow, and they do seem to have fewer rainy days).

Geneva
London

It is fairly quiet, and lacks the bustle and buzz of bigger cities (or even many smaller ones).

But if the work opportunities are there then why not. I'd like to live there just to be close to the alps.

Well if you both hate London and have no ties there, and you think you can easily get jobs in Geneva, why not just give it a go?

I had a friend who lived there and agree with the above that it's a little dull, and has pretty bad weather, but for me the drawcard would be the proximity to good skiing in winter and other mountain-based activities in winter.

Bear in mind that finding accomodation in Geneva is extremely difficult. Say, 200 people could easily apply for one normal apartment... Do you know about this?

hello there,

I live near Geneva and have worked in Geneva a few years.
You can sure find jobs here but is it really worth it?
I'd say no.
These are some of the reasons:

-Flats are almost impossible to find, it will be outstandingly expensive if you do(count 1000£/month for a 40sqm)
-It's an expensive city with not much to offer. it's good for working, not so interesting for entertainment.
-People are cold and unfriendly.
-Transports aren't that efficient.

It will be a bit more relaxed than London but I wouldn't recommend it. When people say it's boring it's correct, nothing ever happens (no events, almost no bank holidays, not much life other than work) Actually, I'd suggest you skip Switzerland as it ends up being very boring wherever you may end up, you'll also end up working much more than anywhere else in Europe.

Edited by: jinbo

Very very welcome to Geneva.The place is very very cosmopolitan.More than 2/3 of people are foreigners or strangers.The city may have a lack of swissness.People who don't normally like it are the ones who have not tried to learn a bit of french or don't care about the city.It really worth exploring and getting into the local life.Step in and you will love it.Most of people speak good english,some(most of them old,French or from sudden countries) don't.Anyway everyone will be please to help you except some anti-globalization guys who don't like banks and multinational compagnies.Do not hesitate to check all bars and restaurants as they are so many.Some days some are very packed some boring and vice versa.Get inform about parties or special events.The best venues are in rue Ecole de Médecine,Bd Carl-Vogt,Paquis aera,Rue des Savoises,Rue Prévost-Martin,Carouge aera,Old town,Rue des Noirettes,Rue du Stand,Place du Cirque,Rue Arquebuse,Rue Richemont,Rue Lissignol,Rue carouge,rue Leschot,en l'ile,Rue coulouvrenière et Stand,Rue des Etuves and so on.In any case don't get stuck in the hyper centre aera as it may some days be a bit dull at night.You need to explore a bit more to find the best places.Moreover many are typically english or irish as the Pickwick pub,The clubhouse(burgers,sunday roast)The key and Eagle,the lady Godiva(fish and chips,burger),the seven,the Mulligans,l'ethno,le Scandale,Alhambar ect....Have a good look around,explore the city on foot.Anyway i am sure you will get to know very good english and french speaking friends.For buying english food go to coop city(city center),The american market,globus,American food avenue,Jim's british market in Gland and St-Genis Pouilly and so on.They have good english or american products such as peanut butter,crips,drinks and much more.For good burgers and awesome choice go to Holy cow and Inglewood.On sundays:Remor,Lady Godiva,clubhouse are open....As the venues in the hyper centre tend to be expensive and top notch go to the side districts and their side streets to grab a bargain.Walk around and enjoy life in Geneva and its great surroundings.Weather is mild all year round but 8 weeks a year it may be very cold and very windy(north strong cold wind),snowy or very wet.Geneva in summer is just great.Lot of festivals and parties.You will feel like by the Med.Winter good fun parties,winter sport and fun in great outdoors.As Geneva is straight in the heart of Europe and the airport very good connected to main european destinations,your flight will last between 50 minutes and less than 3 hours.The long haul daily and direct flights are Dubai(Emirates),Doha(Qatar airways),Abu Dhabi(Etihad airways),Washington(United),Newark(United),JFK(Swiss),Montreal,Toronto(Air canada).Direct Asia flights are expected within the next 5 year....

Edited by: se210

se210, don;t underestimate the value of the occasional line break (hitting the enter key)

Hi,
we've lived in Geneva for about 4 years now and I'd say that - compared to other cities - it is not as straightforward to get "into", especially if you're coming from London, NY etc.

it took us a really long time to find good places to eat, go out etc. basically these are the places the locals go to but they're a bit out of the beaten track of those who move here from abroad
here's a good blog about life in geneva [http://www.genevafamilydiaries.net/] you'll also find info on other local blogs, forums, Swiss colleagues etc. beware of locally self-published books for expats, all the places they recommend are not that great, which in turns will lead you to think that life in Geneva is not much fun

if you can, also try to find a job BEFORE moving here, not much emphasis is put on CV as it is in London, it's all about connections which you need time to make when you come from abroad

good luck !
Michela

Geneva vs. London, hmmm let me think about that. Well actually, I don't have to think about it, it's a no-brainer. You couldn't pay me to live and work in London. For the reasons you mention as well as others.

As for living in Geneva, I'd move there for a few years in a heartbeat if only for its location alone. While I would agree that for SOME people it might be a bit hard to adapt, that does not mean it is difficult for everyone. Being a successful (if we can call it that) expat is not about the place you move to. It is ALL about you as a person. Some people can be happy livng anywhere and some can be happy nowhere.

The single biggest reason for people returning home after trying living abroad, is an inability to adapt to DIFFERENT! It's not about a place being good or bad or how things work being right or wrong, they are just different and some people simply can't deal well with that.

In any place you find a lot of expats you find the same groups. One group is those who spend a lot of time with other expats bemoaning how things are different from home and how the locals are not friendly or want to rip them off etc.

Another segment (they don't tend to 'group' together) spend little time with other expats, have local friends, are involved in local events and can't see any problems worth bothering about. There are a few segments in between these 2 but I think it should be easy to see which is more likely to be a 'successful' expat.

I would ignore anyone saying Geneva is boriing for example. What they are actually saying in my opinion is that THEY are boring. The only way to ever know how you will like a place is to live there and find out. There is no other way and taking anyone else's opinion for it is just dumb.

I used to live in London and gave it up 5 years ago to move to Switzerland.
I am a management consultant and found a job directly from London using Swiss recruitment websites. The best one was Qual ( www.qual.ch</a> ) which specializes in upper professional roles and has features allowing for total confidentiality.

Above a certain level companies relocate you. The thing is, once you are in Switzerland, you have to learn French or German depending on whether you choose to live in Geneva or Zurich. There are expats who don't but it puts a brake on your career development.

Edited by: wanewman

hi everyone,
thanks for all the input... here is an update on the situation. I did move from London to Geneva last August and have been here over a year now. Almost every single day I am thankful that I moved... I love my life here in comparison to London. Here are some details:

Weather- true it rains here a lot and if you just look at the charts it looks like more than London, the difference is that here in Geneva when it rains it really rains, and then it stops and turns to blue skies, whereas in London it's a constant depressing drizzle and the white/grey clouds just stay overhead for weeks at a time. January and Feb were cold, but the heating in the buildings is great and the cold isn't as damp as in London so I didn't mind. The big difference in winter is that apartments have double or triple glazing so even if it's cold outside it's not inside, unlike my apartments in London where I was freezing even with the heat on full blast. And the summer here is amazing- it's actually hot and you can wear shorts and a t-shirt most days, whereas in London I could count on one hand the number of times I wore a skirt or shorts during three summers I spent there.

Apartments/Housing- true it's expensive and very difficult to find a place in Geneva. I did find a place quickly but you need to know people or be willing to pay a lot to sublet from an expat. On the plus side though all the apartments I've seen are well kept, clean, well insulated, and easy to live in, unlike the numerous dirty, run down, old apartments I visited in London. Here I can live in the city centre and bike to work in 20 minutes, whereas for the same price I could only live in zone 2/3 in London.

Lifestyle- people who say Geneva is boring probably are probably not trying very hard to find things to do. There are a ton of museums, theatres, concerts, etc. True not all of it is free, but even on a budget you can find interesting things to do. The summer time is amazing with free fairs, concerts, outdoor movies, etc pretty much every single night between June-Aug. Winder is weird in that people seem to dissapear off the streets, but I assume that's mostly because they have private parties indoors or go skiing on the weekends- which is amazing because the French alps are less than 1.5 hours away (door to ski lift). It's also extremely easy to travel around- either in Switzerland with the public transport, into France/Italy with a car, or other countries with the airport that services just about the whole world and is only 6 mins from the city centre and is small enough that you only need to get there about an hour before your flight. In comparison I thought in London I'd do a ton of stuff but in reality barely did anything because transport was always such a pain... by the time the weekend came around half the lines were closed and I was so tired of the tube from my daily communte that I couldn't be bothered to go to the city centre. And while Ithought in London I'd easily take weekend trips to Rome, Vienna or Berlin, in reality with the time lost to get to/from the airports in London I never did a single weekend trip because I would have lost have the weekend just traveling.

Job- I was very lucky in that I lined something up before I left London and continue to work in my sector in a great job. Now that I'm here I realise I'm doubly lucky because I do think it can be difficult to find a job here. But if you do have solid work experience and can speak English/French then you can probably find something, and the salary will be a lot higher than in London- at least in my case. Which means that though life is more expensive, my income is even higher, so the balance works in my favor.

People- I don't have such a big network here yet, but that's largely because I travel 50% of the time and don't have much time to spend on meeting new friends. There are a lot of expats here and if you want to pick up that party lifestyle there is certainly a big "freshman pack" mentality/crowd who go to bars and parties every weekend. If you're looking for a more stable set of friends that aren't part of the crowd that comes and goes from Geneva in 1-2 year cycles then it takes a bit more time and effort, but it can be done. I'd say this is the same problem in London and at least I personally find the people living in Geneva friendlier as a whole than those in London.

In summary I'm very glad to have moved here. It's not for everyone and I'm sure some people prefer London, but if you don't like London (like I didn't) then Geneva could be a good new destination.

d

Good update ladyd. It's rare for someone to return and give an update. When someone does it encourages regulars who offer advice/info etc. to continue doing so.

I got a chuckle at some of your comments about the differences in weather, heating, etc. between London and Geneva. The same could be applied of course to many places. Here in Canada, Vancouver lovers always go on about how their city has the 'mildest' climate in Canada. The choice of adjective is deliberate since it refers only to the average year round temperature and says nothing about the number of days with rain. This year I think they actually got about 1 week of what I would consider summer weather. ie. over 25c and blue skies with no rain all day.

Clearly, you have worked at making the most of what Geneva has to offer you and maintained a positive outlook. As I wrote in #10, it's all about the individual, not the place.

I love almost everything about Switzerland. What struck me foremost about Geneva is that it is quite similar to San Francisco. There are sort of seedy areas and people tend to be a bit more aggressive than in Zurich, where I find the people more amenable. I have the impression that le gens in Genève tend to do most of their socialising in private, considering the real estate here tends to be quite posh with estates located all over the area, so doesn't really offer much for young people who are looking for nightlife culture. That being said, there is something really lovely about being located right on the water. It's almost as if one is going back in time, with the influences of CERN and particle physics in addition to the United Nations' influence over the global world. I gather this isn't the sort of place where one rents a flat, more of an area where people might consider investing in real estate.