“If you are 35 and can only point to a couple of 2 year or less stints of real work in between university time, I'd pretty much figure you were too far gone to be employable at much other than Starbucks.”
“Someone at 25 who decides to be a beach bum may be very happy for 10-15 years before reality catches up with them. … At 65 with insufficient pension funds they would sing a different tune.”
A poster on TT who imho consistently gives valuable advice (while also ruffling feathers) made the above two posts and many similar in the past.
As someone about to hit 30 these have got me thinking. I think I agree with that by your early thirties it is too late to get a decent career going, but would enjoy a good debate here on the topic.
I just want to spark debate really but if I had to kick of with a few they would be:
Aren’t these (the posts) an old school view of the world? Isn’t the workplace becoming more accepting of travel, and more appreciative of the life experience and soft skills you can bring?
Similarly with the world being such a different place, how much weight can someone my age give to advice from people over 65 about career/ money/ pensions?
In your experience what sectors and countries like/ dislike long travel stints most?
What can a person say in a CV or interview to make you think of their travels as an asset? Not the obvious I volunteered, learnt a language
And finally, I have just found a job I enjoy and plan to stick with long enough to get some experience and build a career. Like many posters here I have a degree (B.A) but did not worry at all about my career until recently. So, after 3 or 4 years of this, my first real job in HR, could I travel for a year or would I be back to square one? I plan to settle back in Oz.
X-posted
My advice is to listen to people of your own age since they surely know what they are talking about especially if they have changed jobs every 6 months.
Yes the workplace really enjoys its employees taking time out to travel, because it gives them a chance to train someone new for the job at sometimes not unconsiderable expense.
Us old farts know absolutely nothing and can't be relied on for pertinent information.
My 0.02 worth.
post*1 dont whine he`s young he will learn
by the way that was my first reaction too, but remember the slogan never trust nyone above the age of 30, .....
i am not quite 65 but
almost every pension plan is insufficient , just look at the numbers
this means tracking the last 20 years promises and what really happens
travel is fine but not for a company
they want persons who work for little money, not dreamers
if you look at the branches and the questions that are put down, sometimes on one day three times the same
is that what you would hire as a responsible person working for you
rather look for a boss you can tell the truth it was fun travelling, i did not want to work at that time, i thought i miss something if idid not do it when i did it
at least in western europe you are considered old if you are above 40 and someone else is scratching allready
so its your decision travel have fun
or a dull job
is there a decent social security in your country?
er...
not sure why RGM wants to take the mickey. I'm not listening to the advice of those friends who keep changing jobs. If it wasn't clear I am now trying to work hard, save and plan for my future.
Despite your (apparent) attitude to young people, I believe with age comes wisdom and I simply like older people. Hence the post on this branch. I expect other replies to be more helpful or funny than yours.
lhasaipso, thanks for your response. The figures I've seen in talk of 'the pension crisis' have probably affected my views on this more than anything. But I don't want to rely on social security at all.
And so far I have been honest and said that it was travel was simply more of a priority for me in my younger years. I guess I am just wondering how I could articulate the feelings I have about what I have gained from my travels. So far it seems like my travelling has made me less vulnerable to stress and more of a lateral thinker than my colleagues who haven't. Btw I'm a she.
A good interviewer will soon find this out with the right question. When I interview staff after the usual qualification and experience related questions my little chit chat before showing the applicant out is often about travel. The answers can be really funny or off putting from drunken brawls in sleezy pubs to hanging around a corner, equipped with handbag, high heels and condoms, however most people are quite sincere with a reply covering the fact that travel as you mentioned is not the priority it was, that during the years travelling they have acquired more patience and tolerance, learned to be self reliant and more motivated and lateral thinking. The hints often dropped that the successful applicant can, subject to negotiation (we are a great company), after a qualifying period have an unpaid month off bi annually as well as the usual leave provisions. Often that is sufficient to retain a really good staff member as it satisfies the travel itch yet and gives the applicant the feeling that they are not trapped into a soulless full time job. (Im lucky I get 6 weeks annually and partly paid as long as I fit around specific dates). It works both ways as a good company no longer looses a good employee but the conditions have to be thought out quite carefully to ensure no ones disadvantaged, including offsiders who cover for the one on special leave. (we don't care what they do with the month and they don't have to take it but again use it or loose it applies)
Im 60 (an older interviewee) and interview for staff for approx 10 vacancies a year and never worry if the gaps in the CV have been caused by travel - however am very suspicious of Joe Bloggs who has lived in the same town or part of the country and changes jobs annually, unless working for companies I know are awful, or work on contract only.
Pension crisis are very real and quite frightening - and again employers will recognise thats often a motivating factor to settle, as are the usual domestic changes.
You appear to be articulate and well educated so im sure will have no problem - good luck anyway
My 35-year work career in software development taught me a couple of things relative to your questions, insofar as a techical career goes:
1) Your hobbies and travel experiences have little effect on whether you get a job.
2) Changing employers every 2-3 years is/was considered the norm. During my working days that was the only way to get decent raises.
3) Almost all my job opportunities came about from networking contacts I made in previous jobs.
4) Being good at what you do is important. Being reliable is as important.
Thirty five is definitely not too old to be considering a career. Think of all the (mostly ) females who have years out of the work force, many who may have not had highly skilled jobs before having families. I know plenty who have gotten careers later, some with and some without taking training courses first.
Then there are all the folk who decided on a complete career change at 30, or 40, retain and still get jobs.
Or those who have always had the skills to walk in and out of jobs as they combine a balance of travel and work.
Advice from people over 65? Well, I like to think that I am willing to listen to others opinions and points of view, but not be swayed by their advice ( no matter what the age.) Who knows what the future holds for any individual?
Thanks ohwell, I wish all interviewers were as understanding as you seem to be.
It sounds like you have a switched on HR department. I imagine it makes a difference what sector you are in as to whether your travels are brought up in an interview and whether you get a chance to say what you have gained.
la vache, your last three points sounds spot on to me.
However, I think your first one relates more to software developers and perhaps accountants etc. I would expect that a lot of what people gain from travel are people skills, understanding of diverse cultures, lateral thinking etc. Perhaps the last skill applies to IT but I would imagine (hope?) it's more relevant to people in HR, teachers or social workers.
Biffy I won't blindly follow advice but, if it rings true and comes from people who have a perspective that I don't, then I might be swayed. Just because the future is uncertain doesn't mean I can't learn from others who have the benefit of hindsight.
The reason you might want to listen to older folk like me (I'm 56) is that we've been occupying the senior positions in the last 15 years of our careers that decided whether or not to hire people like you.
What I looked for, no matter what the position was the appropriate education, necessary skills, applicable experience and a willing attitude. If I had one position and was interviewing five people for it, the candidate with the best combination of above got the job. It was that simple. I don't care if you've been traveling or not traveling or whatever ...that's of no account. What matters is getting the best qualified employee for the job .... and, of course, that willing attitude thing.
If I get the impression in the interview that you are just angling to find out how quickly you can get away to travel again ...that's not a willing attitude.
If other candidates on my interview list have more appplicable experience because they have been working instead of traveling ..well, they are going to get the job.
Maybe traveling has made you more tolerant or more self reliant or whatever ...but maybe some of the experiences of people who have not been traveling have given them the same qualities ...the fact that it came from travel is just not relevent.
Don't get me wrong ...I am NOT anti-travel. Far from it. I left the full-time workplace for consulting work at 52 so that I could have the flexibility to travel at will so I DO understand.
As to whether you can leave your positiong after 3-4 years and get hired back again will depend on 1) whether you leave them in the lurch or make a well-planned exit
2) how valuable you have become to them 3) how competitive your field is.
If you leave and they find a great person to replace you with similar or even better skills, they won't have any reason to hire you back. Whether you get as good a position in another company will depend on how competitive your field is.
I found that I had considerable difficulty getting long leaves from my work (communications - publishing). I remember putting a great deal of effort into preparing my staff, documenting everthing, working till midnight to get ahead of the curve ..whatever, so that I could take a 5 week trip. I even checked email every couple of days and stayed in touch with my staff. Everything went off perfectly.
When I came back I was talking to my boss and she acknowledged that everything had gone off flawlessly (she had been against me taking 5 weeks at once). "So well," she said, "I can see that we may not actually need you." Soooooo no credit for getting all the ducks in a row. That was when I realized I needed to switch to consulting work.
BUT don't think consulting work is the answer when you are 30. It comes at the end of a long career with a lot of contacts and you need a LOT of contacts to make it work. The first person to be cut out of the budget when money gets tight is the consultant. So you need a large portfolio of clients to ensure you have reasonably steady work. There are no medical benefits, no pension plan, no committment from employers so you neve know where the next job is coming from or even whether something you counted on will fall through because someone's priorities shift. So it's perfect when you've put in your time and you don't NEED the steady money.
I also took a career break between 30 and 37 while I had my kids. I did contract work during this period and I will never regret taking the time off to raise my babies, but careerwise it took me at least five years to get back into the groove and regain my former level and salary.
So, just some thoughts.
At 35 you have lived five 7-year spans of life. That is a very good time to evaluate your quality of life and decide what you will do to maintain or improve it.
Have you positioned yourself for financial security or do you need to inform yourself better on that subject? You can read books about that or get a check up with a financial advisor.
Are you suited to the work you do? By now you know if you are the kind of person who enjoys moving from place to place and job to job or if you are happier in an established career. If you choose to make a change, develop a strategy. Do you need more education or training? Do you need more information about employer requirements?
Do you need personal enrichment? Are you doing everything you can for optimal health? Are your relationships on a good path? Is it time to travel, near or far, a weekend or years? Do you have interests that give you enjoyment? Sports, crafts, volunteering, learning in any field all are potential sources of personal enrichment.
The decade of the 30's is in fact a time when many people finish career preparation, exit the military, have acquired trade skills, or have been a stay at home parent and are ready to make a significant life change. It is unfortunate if they do not see this as a normal part of life and become overwhelmed and panic. Evaluating your quality of life is appropriate at any age, but you derive the greatest benefit from keeping all that is good and proceeding to develop a workable plan.
trusted partner
