History buffs looking for offbeat suggestions (Italy, Germany)

Hi,

History is a matter where you can talk about endlessly, is it not about a certain subject then it can be about the level of knowledge that is involved. So you have to start somewhere and actually it comes down where your specific personal interest is. So the suggestion of OP to ask about personal experiences is for me a good idea. But if I talk for instance about Maarten Luther, it means for me a lot but what does it mean for you inkhearted? To be more specific, visiting in Eisleben the Petrikirche where he was baptised, the most striking was the lack of attention there payed to this famous person. Not that they want to remember, but as a sign of modesty, expressing very well the mentality of the envirement where he grew up. That mentality was the base of the succes of the Reformation. This kind of experiences attracts me and you have to go to the historic spot to get as close it can to get more or less in contact with it and understand what actualy makes such a place so interesting. So please respond and give us an idea if this kind of experiences is in line what you expect to discover.

wilco3

Neuschwanstein Palace has little of historic interest unless you are interested in the history of tourism. It was built as a palace in the late 1800s by a largely insignificant king (except for tourism) but is an architectural masterpiece with a lovely setting on the edge of the Alps. The problem with most "real" castles in Germany is that they were allowed to fall into ruin and were quarried for stone before the time of historismus in the 1800s when many were rebuild, sometimes with fanciful plans that didn't resemble the original ones. Haut Koenigsbourg in Alsace, France was rebuilt in the 1900s, making it even newer. Others, over time, were converted to palaces that may bear little resemblance to the former castle.

There are probably 100s of routes throughout Germany based on one factor or another. For instance, if you are interested in the Staufer emperors who ruled to as far away as Sicily, there is a route in Baden-Wuerttemberg based on them. There are others such as the Swabian Poets Route, Half-Timbered House Route, Fairytale Route, Tree-Lined Roads Route, etc. so if you search hard enough, you might be able to find something of particular interest to you.

There is no lack of historic places to visit in Germany having over 30,000 castles and palaces alone, and anywhere in Germany should have at least a week or two of excellent things to visit there and nearby, if not months' worth of them. The German state with the most listed historic buildings is Baden-Wuerttemberg ( http://www.tourismus-bw.de ) followed closely by Bavaria, and for tourism they are numbers 1 and 2 but in the reverse order. Together, they probably have about half of such buildings in Germany. Both of these states are located along the southern edge of Germany, and because Baden-Württemberg is much smaller than Bavaria, its concentration of historic places is much greater.

http://www.schloesser-und-gaerten.de has information on the excellent castles, palaces, monasteries and gardens that the state of Baden-Württemberg operates. All websites I have given can be changed to English, and if you look at the individual sites in this website, it has anecdotes about each place along with other information. I can highly recommend the 3 medieval monasteries UNESCO Maulbronn, Bebenhausen and (Gross)comburg), all are well-preserved and delightful to visit. The Residenz in Ludwigsburg is Germany's largest perfectly-preserved (all original, not a post-War rebuild like too many places)) palace which has the original furnishings throughout its history and several different architrectural styles as they changed with time. It has the longest (1.5-2.5 hours) and best palace tours that I've had in all of Europe and I've seen quite a few palaces, just make sure that you take the once a day early afternoon English one as it is better than a tour in German. The impressive fortress ruins Hohenneuffen has excellent views as it is built perched on a tall steep cliff edge. The largest castle (fortress) ruin in area is Hohentwiel with excellent views over the Swiss Alps.

Our favorite town in Germany to repeatedly revisit is Tuebingen ( http://www.tuebngen.de ), just quintessential Germany with its hilly cobblestone streets, half-timbered houses, castle, interesting nontourist shops, one of Germany's oldest universities, and the nextdoor delightful medieval well-preserved Bebenhausen Monastery which also has some more modern history being the last residence of the King of Württemberg after he was forced to abdicate following WW-1 and also the seat of post-WW-II government for combined Württemberg and the Hohenzollern Prussian lands. Just south of there is Burg Hohenzollern ( http://www.burg-hohenzollern.com ) which is the rebuilt historic seat of the Hohenzollern family of Romanian and Prussian kings and German emperors.

Just a few ideas of excellent places I always enjoy revisiting in this part of Germany. For some other ideas in the area, have a look at what I wrote in #1 of http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g187275-i116-k6068438-Stuttgart_as_a_base-Germany.html#49932873 .

Ah, Martin Luther, which led up to one of the most destructive times for what is now Germany, the Thirty Years War, where Protestant and Catholic forces battled across Germany, burning each others churches and thereby destroying most of the all-important church records. Although occuring centuries ago, this has largely shaped Germany into its Protestant and Catholic areas to the present day. My wife is from Biberach an der Riss which has the oldest church used simultaneously for centuries by both congregations but for separate services. It is my favorite church in Germany, perhaps because I was married in it, an excellent blend of Catholic ornateness with Protestant simplicity!!!! As a tourist it's a good thing to know what area you are in because the ornate Catholic churches are usually kept open at all times whereas the usually much more bland Protestant ones are usually kept locked except for services.

But as stated above, there is plenty of history, ranging from mankind's first musical instruments and art from 35,000 years ago to modern times, and perhaps one should be more concerned about particular times in history rather than the too broad history in general. This can steer you to particular parts of Germany that best meet your interests.

Do you have an interest in a special region or area in Germany? That would narrow it down a lot. F.i. the time when the franks ruled central Europe, or when the Saxons became the first kings and emperors of Germany, the Hanseatic league, the religious wars in 1546 and 1618-1648 (although real reason was of power and money) or the time when Napoleon conquered Germany?

It would be easiest to pick a nice area and concentrate on that. You'll find something interesting in most regions. F.i. in my recent home region in central Germany you could pick areas like the Harz Mountains or the Unstrut and Saale Valley and could fill several days each. But that would apply for many other areas as well. Just as some starters:

Harz Mountains - northern edge/slope:

Brocken (mountain/legends with witches)
Thale (gorge/legends with giants)
Goslar (former power house of German (Saxon) emperors with beautiful old town and silver mines)
Wernigerode (beautiful old town with old but 19th ct. neo-style fairy tale castle and steam trains to Brocke summit)
Quedlinburg (same as Goslar except silver mines, but with castle and grave of the first German king)
Other places around for history: Halberstadt, Magdeburg(only some churches survived 30year war and WW II), Braunschweig

Harz Mountains - southern slope:
Stolberg/Harz (small renaissance castle, half timbered houses, woods)
Kyffhäuser (small mountains with several castles dating back to the Saxon area . The legend says that emperors Barbarossa (who died in a river marching towards Jerusalem) sleeps in this mountains and will come back some day), castle ruin in Neustadt/Harz.

The Saale Unstrut area offers interesting places like Freyburg, Naumburg, Weißenfels, Merseburg, Memleben, the ruins Rudelsburg and Saaleck, a side step to Querfurt maybe.....
Some of these places had been built as frontier forticfications guarding the left Saale river side against the Slavaian tribes at the righten side (and supressing them).

Moreover Erfurt is my favorite town in Germany. (@marcopolko: I have never been to Tübingen:-)

But that's just what I can suggest because I know this area best. Franconia, Swabia or the Rhine and Mosel valley would totally be able to offer the same or even more. Furthermore have a look at German UNSECO sites. They are touristy, but mostly chosen for good reasons.

If you're not interested in a special era/topic but just in castle and quaint towns I could suggest the following video links to make a choice:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvF-9KQjYKc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFxbgwoumKQ

Well, I'm getting confused now about your options. There really is just so much to see and you've picked 2 large areas in Germany and Italy. But the last few posts above would suggest you need to narrow your field a bit - perhaps by historic period (Etruscans, mediaeval, barock for example), theme (religion, art) or geography. You could easily spend a month between Rome and Florence, or between Berlin and Dresden, and Thuiringia is full of historic sightrs as Wilco has pointed out (though he left out Naumburg!!) for example. I think you need to re-examine your options and be more specific about what you want to look at. You can't do it all in just a few weeks so you need to define your choices a bit more.

Just wanted to say thanks for the Atlas Obscura website. It's been keeping me occupied for hours at work! :P
Cheers.

Miramare: could probably get very popular with foreign tourists if the more than 50 years old Sound and Light show would be reactivated and if the Triestini would push tourism, for example by creating good transport offers to the neighbouring gems like Grotte di San Cassiano, Lipizza, Postumia, Montona, Parenzo .......
I have somewhat the impression that Tourism officials there have not yet realized that the Iron Courtain doesn't exit any longer

You are absolutely right. We spent a beautiful holiday with base in Trieste and day trips all over the area, including Slovenia, years ago. Miramar with its rocky beach and crystal clear water, Duino castle (very interesting, with a coastal walk to reach it), the World War I monument in Redipuglia, the underground Timavo river emerging nearby, Grotta Grande, absolutely beautiful, the equally interesting caves of Postumia in Slovenia, Lipica which is appealing even though you don't know nothing about horses, the a trip to Ljubljiana, another to Aquileia...

#15: Thanks, I got it from the USA Board (poster Flagstuff).
And tremendous link european, where to begin?

A new short series on BBC Radio 4 is entitled "The Invention of Italy". You should find it at http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03dfp5r . It is good at relating Italy to the other influences of Europe which I suggest makes it appropriate for all history buffs