Anyone experienced this?? I don't mean people scamming you in touristy places or little kids coming up to you saying "give me money" , I'm talking about nice people you've met, people you've made friends with who are not there to scam you but suddenly experience some financial hurdle and ask you as a rich foreigner for help. It's happened to me before but never a very large amount of money. A couple in Flores, wife local, husband Taiwanese are experiencing financial difficulties, the wife is applying for a spouses visa, the husband had to urgently go home, and they don't have enough money and have asked me for AU$2000, which is about 3 weeks salary for me and I currently don't have a lot more in my bank account. I should have said that I didn’t have enough money in the first place but I stupidly didn't, I told them that my bank didn't recognize the branch so I couldn’t transfer the money but the couple are still persisting. Has this happened to anyone and how did you deal with it? Should I just ignore them? They say they would pay me back, and I'm sure that he would have a decent enough salary in Taiwan to be able to do that but I can't be too sure and my worry is that if others will find out, they will ask me in the future. I met this couple in the place I was staying in Maumere, they were related to a priest who lives there who had studied in Australia so I’m worried that others in Maumere and their family in Bajawa will catch on and request alarge sum of money from me? ANyone got any advice?
That is scary.
You better do a runner if you can still escape their clutches.
You will NEVER SEE YOUR MONEY AGAIN>its gone once you pass it to them.
Don't give the money under any circumstances!!! As you say yourself he probably has a good job in Taiwan. I feel you are being scammed. Pamela.
Being asked for money by Indonesian friends is nothing unusual, nor is it as wrong as Westerners might think.
However your story has two unusual aspects.
1: The husband being Taiwanese. He should know that's not how things work.
2: The amonut - HUGE!
You really started this the wrong way by not claiming you could not help straight away, so unless they are REALLY good friends of yours, I'd suggest simply ignoring further, persistant claims.
Surely the Taiwanese guy should have closer friends/relatives back in wealthy Taiwan to count on!
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<hr>I'm talking about nice people you've met, people you've made friends with who are not there to scam you but suddenly experience some financial hurdle and ask you as a rich foreigner for help<hr></blockquote>
You don't think so, but YES what they're doing IS a SCAM job.
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<hr>A couple in Flores, wife local, husband Taiwanese are experiencing financial difficulties, the wife is applying for a spouses visa, the husband had to urgently go home, and they don't have enough money<hr></blockquote>
So? There are variations of this story going on throughout the world for the purpose of scamming good hearted and naive people.
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<hr>Should I just ignore them? <hr></blockquote>
Yes. See the advice on the second sentence on post #1.
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<hr>They say they would pay me back<hr></blockquote>
So? How do you know they WILL follow through? A$2000 is a lot to ri$k on some stranger's word without know if it's true or not, right?
As Laszlo says, the concept of asking for money is not as "wrong" as we might feel. It's a very key thing in Indonesian culture to spread money around among family and friends: a wealthy uncle will often buy cars, houses, fund expensive foreign educations etc for fairly distant family memebers, and particularly wealthy individuals sometimes do the same thing for close friends. As a traveler from the "West" you are always percieved as outrageously wealthy (which can be a little trying when your a shoestring backpacker - or worse still an English teacher on an Indonesian salary). Equally, your transient nature, and the brief nature of your visit will mean that such subjects may be raised rather more quickly than decorum would require. However, that does not mean that the family with whom you've been hanging out for a couple of hours who raise the subject of financial help with some medical or educational costs or whatever had nothing but that venal consideration in mind the moment they invited you into their home for coffee and chat. It's taken me a long time to come to that conclusion, and I find that I am now free of that deeply hurt sensation of betrayal when i walk away from such an encounter. That said, I never do hand over the money, principally because I simply don't have anything approaching the wealth they percieve me to have, and because as a culturally bound westerner I am deeply uncomfortable with the idea (i would also almost certainly not pay for my secon cousins to study abroad in the unlikely scenario of my becoming enormously wealthy). A genuinely wealthy Indonesian put in the same situation might react differently.
BUT: The story above sounds utterly outrageous for the reasons metioned above, not least the huge sum, and the fact that the man is Taiwanese... It sounds like one of the very few scenarios in Indonesia to which I might react with a firm "@#$% off!"
The jury's not out on your specific case. The votes are in and they are unanimous. Apparently you had a pang of conscience and sought some counsel. That says some good things about you as you have both a head and a heart. Hopefully you have not forked over any money during the interim.
As a related issue, I'd amplify on one point previously mentioned. One of Laszlo's statements was more general in nature, and deserves some attention. In fact, it is of great cross-cultural interest in my way of thinking.
Though scammers and grifters and con men and touts run aplenty in this struggling nation of 245,000,000 people, legitimate requests for financial help from good people in need is not uncommon.
In the west, we are often leery to mix friendship and business, or become involved with borrowing or loaning money amongst friends. The fear of losing a friend over some cash is really not worth it for many. This may not be a general rule, but a significant percentage bear such trepidations.
In Indonesia, not surprisingly, the culture is different. Friendship and money- or love and money for that matter; these are not easily separated from each other. In fact, they are often indivisible. It is part of the culture; its modus operandi; and also a commentary on how the effects of living on very little shapes the qualities defining human relationships. Friendship is in part measured by its capacity to help one survive. Marriage definitely falls in that category. That is one good reason why the scammers here are so brazen. Monetary requests are nothing unusual.
For the outsider and the uninitiated, it's all a little confusing.
It you are in Indonesia long enough to make what you can trust to be real friends, chances are one of them will ask you for money. The fact you are a foreigner and assumed to be rich (which in all fair comparative measure you are) should not automatically assumed to be their sole reasoning for asking. Friends in Indonesia ask friends for money. It could be that they are paying you a complement after a fashion.
I have made a rule of only giving money to those Indonesian friends who had been open-hearted and in due course asked for little in return. This can only be proved over time, obviously. If they ran into trouble, I would offer it gladly. If this had to do with paying a hospital bill past due, I was especially forth coming.
This is not to say I recommend following suit. It is simply personal and anecdotal. Also, I live in Indonesia, so the context may not apply. If you are just traveling through, the ground rules will somewhat different.
For the foreigner just in off the boat, Indonesians looking for quick cash know a prospect when they see one. They'll pursue that individual with aggressiveness. If you brush them off initially, they usually bug off. Body language goes a long way. Showing absolutely zero interest and walking away from them in mid-sentence is also effective. It's not a pleasant behavior to affect, but sometimes it's necessary.
But yours is an opportunity to learn something about how Indonesians regard money vis-a-vis both love and friendship. Though your particular instance is egregious and seems open and shut, related episodes in the future may be of a more subtle nature. There's often more involved than meets the eye.
I can say one thing about lending money- don't expect it to ever be payed back. But don't doubt the borrower's intention to do so is actually sincere- even if they know they will never be able to! If you are going to hand it over- have it be a gift.
One last thing. It is interesting to note the Bahasa word pinjam is defined as both to borrow and to lend. There is no separate word set aside for each.
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<hr> have made a rule of only giving money to those Indonesian friends who had been open-hearted and in due course asked for little in return. This can only be proved over time, obviously. If they ran into trouble, I would offer it gladly.<hr></blockquote>Same here.
But I always limit the amount or readiness to give, otherwise they'd certainly end up asking more often.
And of course even if they ask to "borrow" that money, I never, for a moment, expect it to be repaid either!<blockquote>Quote
<hr>the Bahasa word pinjam is defined as both to borrow and to lend. There is no separate word set aside for each. <hr></blockquote>Not quite so. For all I know, "pinjam" means to "borrow", while "lend" is "pinjamkam", eg. to "make sg. borrowed"
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