Los Angles - Las Vegas - San Francisco - New York

LA-Las Vegas-San Francisco-New York
by kiralious

29 minutes ago
Hi there, were Aussie first time travel to USA, please let us know whether our itineraries are doable? Thanks

USA Trip (18 days) 26 Nov - 13 Dec

26-28 in LA

How's LA public transport is like? Should we hire a car in LA, or public transport will suffice?

26 Nov thanksgiving day what to do?
27 Nov Black Friday holiday, shopping for Xmas presies?
28 Nov what to do?

Road Trips begins
Sunday 29 November 7am – Pick up 4WD rental in Los Angeles, drive to Las Vegas (Road trip = 4 hours)

Monday 30 November 6am – Day trip to Grand Canyon
(Road trip = 4.5 hours each? Probably best do helicopter tour or bus tour to canyon from vagas instead of road trip?)

Tuesday 1 December 7am – Leave Las Vegas Drive to Death Valley
• Stay 1 night in Death Valley

Wednesday 2 December 6am drive to
Mammoth Lakes, park at Canyon Boulevard, shuttle bus up Mammoth ski.
• Stay 1 night Mammoth Lakes

Thursday 3 December drive to San Fransisco. Road trip ended

Sunday 6 December – 6am flight to New York, don't know what to do in NY yet, if u have any idea pls let us know!

12 Dec flight back to LA
13 Dec flight back Melbourne

I would re think this a bit... AWD may not be necessary. AND, such rented from LA may not have tyres mounted to render the vehicle useful in difficult conditions ... Conditions that may well close the roads to ALL vehicles ... Rent whatever heap in LA(off airport) and use oyr Thanksgiving day to drive direct, to the Grand Canyon South rim (reservations confirmed) Then, back haul on the "Old Rt. 66" to Las Vegas ... Put a day "in" post Mammoth Mtn. as your proposal to drive through the Mtns. in winter conditions is wildly optimistic ... carracar

How's LA public transport is like? Should we hire a car in LA, or public transport will suffice?

It would never occur to me to try to take "public transit" anywhere in "Greater" Los Angeles other than take the tram from the airport to the hotel or the rental car center. Some of the residents of LA on this forum say you can get around on it but it takes time. I also expect that it takes a lot of experience. You must understand that Los Angeles is HUGE. You can travel for 100 miles (161 Km) in a straight line and never leave the incorporation boundaries of the city of Los Angeles. "Greater" Los Angeles, the conglomeration of many cities and heavily urbanized counties (you literally cannot tell where one ends and the next one begins) is several times bigger. The vast majority of Los Angelinos drive. Where do you plan to travel in "Los Angeles?"

26 Nov thanksgiving day what to do?

Americans celebrate Thanksgiving.

27 Nov Black Friday holiday, shopping for Xmas presies?

If you want to dive into that madding crowd, be my guest. I'd rather find a bar and get drunk.

28 Nov what to do?

Google is your friend.

Road Trips begins
Sunday 29 November 7am – Pick up 4WD rental in Los Angeles, drive to Las Vegas (Road trip = 4 hours)

Driving a 4x4 to Las Vegas from Los Angeles is a spectacular waste of money and an uncomfortable ride. Rent a car. It is at least 3 lanes of interstate highway all the way. In places it is 6 lanes of concrete. If snow is the reason you are renting a 4x4, think again. Snow on roads rapidly compacts to ice. 4x4's on ice are the first into the ditch especially if driven by someone unfamiliar with winter driving.

Monday 30 November 6am – Day trip to Grand Canyon

Make the Grand Canyon an overnight. Be aware that there can be snow and temperatures below 0 C. Aussies don't seem any more tolerant of sub-freezing temperatures than azaleas or orchids.

(Road trip = 4.5 hours each? Probably best do helicopter tour or bus tour to canyon from vagas instead of road trip?)

The helicopter from Las Vegas goes to the West Rim. All of the pictures of the Grand Canyon that you have probably seen were taken at the South Rim. This includes the pictures used in the advertising for the West Rim. The West Rim is only impressive if you have never seen the South Rim in the national park.

Tuesday 1 December 7am – Leave Las Vegas Drive to Death Valley
• Stay 1 night in Death Valley

Where are you going to stay in Death Valley? You should definitely know the answer before you go. Reservations are recommended.

Wednesday 2 December 6am drive to
Mammoth Lakes, park at Canyon Boulevard, shuttle bus up Mammoth ski.
• Stay 1 night Mammoth Lakes

More cold and snow are possible on this trip. Just so you know.

Thursday 3 December drive to San Fransisco. Road trip ended

How are you getting there? The high Sierra passes will be closed in all likelihood. You will either have to go around the Sierras by way of Bakersfield or north as far as US-50 or I-80.

Sunday 6 December – 6am flight to New York, don't know what to do in NY yet, if u have any idea pls let us know!

Go to Miami Beach instead?

You don't say what your interests are, what do you want to do and see?

Doesn't sound like you want to do much in LA? If not consider heading out on Black Friday, maybe even Thursday on Thanksgiving, excellent get away day, no traffic.
Dump the 4x4 and get a basic sedan.
Spend a day/night at the Grand Canyon, a day trip from Vegas is just silly.
Do you guys ski?
If you want to drive up Hwy. 395 fro DV, Mammoth and onto SF you'll need an extra day.
Consider a nice loop, LA-DV-Vegas-GC-Zion and fly from Vegas to SF.

Here is an old Lonely Planet blog post about Thanksgiving, including some ideas about what to do as a visitor. Home for the holiday. It's (ahem) an interview with a regular poster.

Almost everything will be closed on Thanksgiving. Banks, post offices, government offices, most businesses, museums & other sightseeing places. Some entertainment venues, including Disneyland and a lot of movie theaters, will be open. Many restaurants, including hotel restaurants, will have special Thanksgiving dinners, that should be booked in advance. (In the US, it's called Thanksgiving "dinner," even if you eat at 2 PM.)

"Black Friday" is not a holiday per se. It's a shopping madhouse. In recent years, some stores have begun opening late on Thanksgiving Day to start the frenzy early. There has been a fair amount of backlash about this, so some have stopped the practice. As for buying Christmas presents (we don't give "pressies" here, nor will anyone have heard of "Crimbo"), the big thing on Black Friday is to get to a large chain store early and buy one of the limited supply of something big (a giant TV), the latest electronic goody (a same system) or the hot new toy. If you just want to shop for presents that are on sale, wait a few days. Crowds will be smaller and the sale will still be one. Don't expect small, specialty shops to have any amazing Black Friday discounts. (BTW, contrary to popular assumption, "Black Friday" did not get its name because businesses go into the black that day. See Black Friday from snopes.)

I agree that the 4WD is overkill. You may run into a snowstorm in the Mammoth area and vehicles must use chains or other "traction devices." 4WD vehicles are sometimes exempt, but you must still have chains in the car. Rental companies sometimes restrict or prohibit chain use, so you should check.

This map shows the drive from Mammoth to SF i winter It's an all-day drive. This route is shorter, and much more scenic, however, there is also a much greater chance that you will have to use chains on much of the route. When you do have to use chains, the speed limit is 25 or 30 MPH (less than half of usual highway speed) so drive time is significantly increased. You can check on the weather forecast the evening before you depart and choose your route accordingly.

Be sure you get your Mammoth lodging reservations in advance.

Agree with Zeldasdad, rent a regular car, use an overseas broker (another poster on here, ian6705, recommends carhire3000), they will include all the insurance you need. You don't really need 4WD.
Find a restaurant serving Thanksgiving dinner if you want to experience it. I would skip Black Friday, it is truly a madhouse and just not worth it.
If driving you need another overnight between Mammoth (do you ski?) and SF, as has been stated many of the passes will be closed due to weather. If you don't have to see Death Valley, you could fly from Vegas to SF. This would also give you more time in SF, which I feel you are shortchanging.

I might move my trip to NYC and the east coast up toward the begining of your trip. NYC's days will be getting shorter and it will be getting colder with each passing day in December, so hitting it early might be nice.

NY has some things to do on Thanksgiving day and is as good a place to shop as LA for black friday. If you are interested you can see the Macy's Thanksgiving day parade.

On the issue of LA on public transit. It is much better than it use to be, but still far from ideal. Look at what you want to do and where you want to stay and try connecting the dots with mass transit. If it isnt 100% easy then rent a car.

You're honestly going to begin your road trip on the Sunday after Thanksgiving? That is probably the single busiest highway travel day in America. Leave on Monday instead.

If you're feeling okay about potential jetlag effects on driving, you might consider starting your road trip as soon as you arrive at LAX. National parks don't close for the holiday (though some of the eating establishments in them might), so they may be more appealing than trying to figure out what to do in a foreign city on a holiday you don't celebrate, or trying to drive around LA on a day when backups from shopping center parking lots extend all the way onto the freeways.

Here is an alternative option, avoiding the Sierra Nevada mountain area, and the drive to San Francisco. These are where you spend the nights:

26 Nov - Los Angeles (get car from LAX - no need for a 4WD)
27 Nov - Los Angeles
28 Nov - Los Angeles
29 Nov - Las Vegas (drive)
30 Nov - Grand Canyon NP (South Rim overnight)
01 Dec - Bryce Canyon NP
02 Dec - Springdale (Zion NP)
03 Dec - Las Vegas
04 Dec - Death Valley NP (day trip)
05 Dec - San Francisco (fly from Las Vegas)
06 Dec - San Francisco
07 Dec - San Francisco
08 Dec - New York
09 Dec - New York
10 Dec - New York
11 Dec - New York
12 Dec - New York - LAX
14 Dec - Melbourne (you lose a day)

This option adds the wonderful rock canyons north of the Grand Canyon NP, and doable in winter (but it's very cold).

Also, on your return to Melbourne, I recommend you do it as a continuous trip - so fly from New York to LAX in time for a late evening flight back to Australia on 12 Dec or 13 Dec. Leaving LAX and spending a night in LA is an unnecessary hassle to break the journey.

We really enjoyed the HI Downtown Hostel in San Francisco - central, and close to the train to and from San Francisco Airport. We stayed at the Super8 Culver City in LA - sort of close to Santa Monica, the Hollywood/Beverly Hills area, and LAX Airport - quite good for three nights (if Disneyland is not on your agenda).

I wouldn't concern myself with Thanksgiving and Black Friday etc - there are too many other attractions available to you, so you can bypass these cultural events. New York can be cold and perhaps wet - with short days too - take your woollens.

Hi guys!

Wow thanks all for such good comments!
Sound like we better of heading NYC first then road trip from Vegas back to LA.

So we're thinking of heading to:

27 Nov - 2 Dec
LAX-NYC (JKF)

2 Dec - 6 Dec
NYC - San Fransico (SFO)

6 Dec
SFO-Vegas
Road trip begins
7 Dec Vegas to Canyon
9 Dec Death Valley NP
10 Dec Mammoth Lakes? (Optional) Should we return car in Vegas and catch bus to Mammoth?
Or 10 Dec hot springs in whitemore or mono? Spend a night there?
11 Dec drive back to LA

So far we only booked return tickets to n from Los Angles MEL for me n my partner. We're just in the brainstorming stages n no clues if it sound doable.
Interests: Road trips, Hiking, museums, art, architecture and foods! Love theme parks but not fussed if we can't make it. Dislike crowds and crazy traffics! As an Aussie we thought 4WD would best for road trip, we haven't the car yet but definitely will just pick normal sedan with GPS then :)
The only reason we wanted to go to Mammoth Moutain was becoz my partner haven't actually been to snow mountain so we thought it might be good to go there from Vegas and spend a night there?

Las Vegas and Grand Caynon
- love to stay a night in each loaction!

NYC, love the list you guys recommended! We still having trouble deciding where to stay, we looking at booking ours accomodation via AirBnB, not sure if it a good idea?

Thanks again guys!

If your partner hasn't seen a proper mountain range with snow on it, then that's a good reason, although it's quite possible to have significant snow out at the Grand Canyon NP South Rim as well. Does the 6 Dec SFO-Vegas mean you're now flying that sector?

Staying in an Airbnb "whole apartment" in NYC for less than 30 days is now illegal ... I have no idea how or even whether it's enforced, but it is the rule.

However if you wish, you can legally stay in a room of an apartment where the owner is also present (how do they enforce that??) ... that remains okay. And in fact it could be substantially cheaper than a lot of NYC accomm. And my view ... stay south of 20th Street - it's the more interesting part of the city for sure.

And my comment about flying without layover now applies in reverse ... when you land into LAX (usually about 0730) just catch the flight onwards to JFK straight away ... and if it's all Qantas ticketed, the onward flight will wait for you. Have fun ... don't underestimate the cold.

I did most of the same major stops on a trip to the USA last year. I went during their Summer though, but this was my basic itinerary:

• Arrived in LA from Australia and just found a shuttle bus at the airport to take us direct to our hotel. Simple, didn't need to pre-book and didn't really do much waiting (maybe 10 minutes max?), and was relatively cheap.
• In LA we did a lot of walking... a MASSIVE amount of walking. If you have parking at your hotel, I can imagine that a rental car would help you see a lot more. We still had fun in Hollywood, Beverly Hills etc.
• Did a day trip out to Disneyland which was a lot of fun. I'm a big Disney fan so found it quite fun for that reason, however, I live in Brisbane and spent my teenage years with successive annual passes to Dreamworld and Disneyland pales in comparison to Dreamworld. If you don't care about Disney, I'd go to Six Flags if you want a theme park day.
• Flew from LA to Vegas for partying and pool fun. Again we walked up and down the strip SOOOO many times, but I feel like having a car in Vegas would be a total hassle.
• Did a day trip from Vegas to the South Rim and got a helicopter flight over the Grand Canyon. Was a great trip, very long day, but totally worth it. If you have other stuff to head onto from here though, you're better off spending a night as everyone suggests. Helicopter flight is definitely worth it though.

• Flew from Vegas to NYC. Again, walked all day everyday in NYC but there's so much to see and do everywhere, it's the best way to do it. We caught the subway twice - once to get to a laundromat and once to get to Yankee Stadium. Other than that, you miss too much being underground. Stuff I did in NYC that I highly recommend: 1.Walk the Highline (old raised overland train tracks that have been converted into a gorgeous garden pathway); 2.Central Park, obviously. Just walk and discover; 3.Top of the Rock (viewing platform on the top of 30 Rockefeller Plaza for the iconic aerial(?) view of Central Park. Totally worth it as the views are just stunning. Unfortunately, the Chrysler building is my favourite and is mostly obscured from 30 Rock; 4.Yankees game at Yankee Stadium. We bought cheap seats way up in the bleachers (which was better for our pale, pale skin in the shade) drank beers (which you CAN'T buy in giant sizes as american cartoons would have you believe! ha!), ate pretzels and just enjoyed the relaxed vibe through the boring, boring game of baseball; 5.Saw a Broadway show (The Lion King); 6.Ate bagels as much as possible; 7.Shopped; 8.Ate amazing pizza; 9.Took the Staten Island Ferry for a view of the Statue of Liberty, which was a cool little journey; 10.Just walked... everywhere. Seriously, it's the best.
  My biggest recommendations for what NOT to do in New York is to eat at the major chain restaurants that we hear about from American TV shows. I ate at TGI Friday's, Applebee's and Chipotle and thought they were all terrible and really badly made. We stuck to mostly non-franchise outlets (delis etc.) which is where New York shines to be honest. Great, cheap, tasty food. Another tip for NYC; we had very little luck finding public toilets anywhere. I don't think we found a single public toilet to be honest. However, this is where a Starbucks on every corner is a great thing, because they all have toilets. If you're wandering around all day and need a toilet, find a Starbucks.

• From New York we flew to San Fran. In San Fran we hired a car. We still did some walking, but driving a car around San Fran was a breeze.
• From San Fran we did a day trip out to Yosemite National Park. Absolutely stunning and my absolute favourite part of the whole trip. I will definitely return for a longer stay.
• Road tripped from San Fran down the Pacific Coast Highway back to LA for our flight back to Australia, with a number of stops along the way as well as an overnight stay in Carmel.

Obviously the major differences for us our the seasons, which makes for pretty different trips, but if you have any specific questions from an Aussie's perspective, feel free to send me a message.

10 Dec Mammoth Lakes? (Optional) Should we return car in Vegas and catch bus to Mammoth?

There is one big problem with trying to catch a bus to Mammoth. There isn't one.

LA by public transport...
We visited for nearly a week in 2012 and used transit everywhere. Our hotel (Westin Bonaventure) was downtown and quite convenient to the Metro Center terminal. Hollywood was easy to reach by subway. We went to Long Beach on the Blue Line. We took the Gold Line to Pasadena and after lunch went across to Hollywood on a crosstown bus. On a Sunday morning we went to the Farmer's Market, got to bus stop and schedule showed buses running every 8-9 minutes or something, that's a lot better than most lines here in Sydney Australia. After lunch caught another bus over to Hollywood (again). We even went to Disneyland by train/bus and back by bus, it did take a long time but still we managed okay and the hotel concierge had said the only way was by organised tour $100+ each.
I suppose if you are used to travelling around town by bus and train then you will do alright, if you tend to drive everywhere you will struggle. The fares are cheap and the information is pretty good, but as someone else said, it's an enormous spread out city and journey times are long. I'm sure even the car trips take forever too!

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