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Ill be posting a more detailed trip report at a later date, but Ill pass along some thoughts about a short stay in Queretaro and for Leon, where I arrived today and will remain until La Candelaria.

I hadn´t been to Queretaro in years, and how nicely the city has matured. I´m speaking of the Centro Historico neighborhood - because I didn´t get away from there during the visit.

Though there´s a 136% surcharge for bus departures from the Mexico City airport, the airport and bus company have you by the balls if you want to use the bus services there. Most of the surcharge is airport-imposed. Primera Plus is offering a one-way fare of MX$100 from Terminal Norte, but from the airport the ticket will cost MX$236. With a luggage at the time of day I arrived - 1 p.m. - a taxi would have been necessary, so, overall, the airport bus to QRO was the better choice all around.

The center of QRO was lively, with entertainment in front of the kiosco, a parade by members of the expat community - or representing the various foreign countries who have citizens working in QRO (and some Mexicans who work for those foreign countries), some live music at restaurants at several of the public squares, etc. The zone was full of people - such a more positive situation than one finds in Mexico City`s Centro Historico.

I left QRO for Leon, Guanajuato today. Though I know better, I forgot to advance purchase my ticket on Primera Plus and because of the holiday weekend I had to wait 2 hours for a bus with an available seat. The bus arrived-left late and then we arrived in Leon an hour late, because of heavy traffic on the way there and to points north. We also were slowed by a procession of bicyclists, hundreds of them, on their way to a shrine in Jalisco.

Its been a long time since I was taken by surprise when traveling in Mexico, when I´ve arrived in a destination and said, WOW!. Well, I´ll shout WOW! for a first impression of the center of Leon. This is my first visit here and I wonder why its taken me so long. Attending the state fair was primary motivation, and thatll come tomorrow. However, after I toured the spectacular religious art museum in one of the finest Catedrals I´ve visited anywhere in the country . . . I cant wait for the other cultural attractions. Leon, too, is packed for the three-day weekend - and for the fair. The plaza principal and a couple of other restaurant-bordered plazas with live entertainment, lots of street performers, an exhibition of Hawiian dance, etc., tonight - the joint is jumpin.

I`m headed for San Miguel de Allende after Leon, and then on to the D.F.

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Longford--Thanks, Leon has been on my "tentative" list for a visit. Look forward to the "real"
trip report.

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Second-day opinion of Leon is as strong as it was the first.

Predominant in the Centro Historico district is architecture influenced by a businessman from England, and, I´m supposing, the Porfiriano period in Mexico´s History. There are examples of Colonial-period archecture, but it´s the unusual style which is also found in parts of Mexico City which has caught my eye.

The state fair has one building that's probably as large as three football fields in the NFL in the United States . huge and overpowering - and, for the most part, one large tianguis - the largest such marketplace of mostly junk I´ve ever seen. There is a section, though, where artisans from Guanajuato are provided space to display their wares - but most of these folks are larger scale manufacturers-producers, not the small folks.

Music in the Plaza Principal tonight includes what the Danzon folks enjoy - and the place is packed.

Berto, there´s ample lodging and services of all types available in Leon - it´s Mexico´s sixtth largest city by population. Hotels are available in all price ranges.

I could see myself living in Leon (and many other places in Mexico!). It´s so very centrally located from which to visit Guadalajara, Mexico City, the Pacific Coast, etc., and with an international airport. The place has a lot of cultural activity, also.

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As usual, Longford is spot on. Leon, Guanajuato is a wonderful place--I have lived here the past four years (before that, 3 yrs. in GDl and 1 yr. in MTY). Just a couple of notes here: I have never once encountered any other estadounidense here in Leon (of course, they exist, but my point is that Leon is not Chapala or San Miguel). As a retired schoolteacher from Austin, Texas, I am "in the streets" almost every day (eating all of my meals at comida economicas or restaurantes, etc.), and there just isn't much of a "gringo presence" here. (Imo, speaking Spanish is a must-have in Leon; since it is really not of a tourist place, most citizens speak little or no English).

A second relevant aspect for anyone considering retiring to Mexico*: Leon has many of the amenities that make day-to-day living in Mexico more comfortable; for example, near my house is a huge HEB (with USDA Angus beef shipped in from San Antonio), three Starbucks; four gimnasios (all of which have functioning caminadoras y elipticas), Honda/Toyota/BMW dealerships, three Italian eateries that are actually quite Italianish, a top-notch, if expensive hospital,.....well, you get the point.

*I am distinguishing between visiting a foreign place (traveller) and actually living out the rest of your days there (citizen). I first tried retiring to Siena, Italy--a charming, magical place I had visited annually for twenty years. In the interest of staying positive in this post, let's just say living in Italy is not the same as touring Italy...and now I know it.

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Thanks for the notes:

1) The Primera Plus 100 pesos fare for Norte to Queretaro is a "special" that has gone on for a few months now. Usually the cost is around 165 pesos. I recently traveled Queretaro to MEX and considered going to Norte and cabbing it to save money but decided it just wasn't worth the hassle. But 256 for the airport bus is rather extortionate.

2) I not sure I'd rate Leon as two WOWs but it certainly isn't the bland commercial center so many people make it out to be. The downtown is indeed very nice and the fair is really a big event (I was there last year for the fair and in November for the balloon festival). For kids there is also a rather decent zoo and safari ride. My only negative is that I haven't found any decent hotels since so many seemed geared towards shoe-buying businessmen although the Fiesta Americana is extremely nice if money is no object.

3) Queretaro has changed massively in just the last 12 months. The center gets crowded beyond belief at times and traffic is becoming a problem. Add in the construction of a new convention center, vast new road systems, a seemingly neverending stream of new "gated communities" plus 600 million pesos being spent on hospitals and sometimes I feel the place is nothing but a building site!

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The city is full of hotels, in all price ranges. If you didn´t find one to suit you, you didn´t look very hard. Or, you´re too picky. Howard Johnson on the Plaza Principal has rooms overlooking the nice Plaza, and there are other hotels. The expensive places, which I think you prefer, are, as you indicate, at the Zona Piel. Fiesta Americana, Holiday Inn, etc. I´ll rate the Tlaxcala November fair higher than I would the one I visited in Leon.

I´d rate Leon above Queretaro - overall - to my way of thinking. Queretaro is a noch-up in sophistication (the Centro Historico), but I saw so many truly butt ugly people that it made me turn my head at times, I´ve never seen so many ugly people in one place in Mexico during my years of travel.

Leon was more laid-back, even for a much larger city than Queretaro - two to three times the size when you consider all adjacent areas (the city proper itself is more than double the size of Queretaro), and there´s a wide variey of whatever one could possibly want. I sense a greater cultural presence in Leon - from the ground up, not top down . . . as I thought it was in Queretaro. Leon seemed genuine, Queretaro staged.

Different cities, but ones in which visitors should have little trouble pleasantly occupying at least a couple or several days.

I arrived in San Miguel de Allende today. I´m still looking to encounter my first Mexican. ;-) Lots of foreigners here - really old ones - even more foreigners than I saw in Queretaro . . . at least they´re more concentrated. I saw maybe 1 or 2 foreigners during 3 days at Leon.

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"I saw so many truly butt ugly people" - why are you looking at people's butts on vacation? Incidentally I am out of the country so none of them were me. Not sure how you define "cultural" but Querétaro is more historical - the birthplace of the Independence movement, scene of the defeat of the French, where the Constitution was signed and twice capital of Mexico. Can't think of anything famous that happened in Leon (apart from your visit). I do like Leon though (it's very underrated).

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Hi longford.

That's true, Querétaro growing a lot but, I don't know if you noticed some other things about the Centro Histórico.
Now this zone its being organized by getting all the cables from the center into subterranean, it's a big project.
The Convention Center and City of Arts it's being made as one of the biggest in México, the construction it's impressive.
Leon it´s big but I think that Querétaro it's totally a better place to visit. It's cultural places, colonial architecture, and the Sierra Gorda it's something incredible.
Maybe in some places there is ugly people but I really think its racial thing.
I really don't know what are you referring to. I don't know where you have been.
Let me get you through in your next trip to Querétaro.

JZA

Edited by: docbrown

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Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, that I´ll grant you. My comments aren´t racial in intent. But I do get around the country, and my impressions are mine. I don´t have a financial interest in promoting, or knocking Queretaro.

About relocation of cables, yes, I noticed that - it´s one of the most unpleasant - but sometimes interesting - things about Mexico, the hodge-podge of cables . . . like a spider´s web.

One thing I liked about the Centro Historico area of QRO was the bilingual signage, the signage identifying historical sites. I´m in San Miguel de Allende as I write this and now that the city (and Atotonilco) have been awarded historical status by UNESCO (SMA has been a Mexican national historical site - the entire city - for a very long time now) similar signage has sprung-up (probably before the awarding of the World Heritage status), but I prefer what QRO has done in comparison.

Leon will, I suspect, be no less interesting and enjoyable a place to visit than is QRO or San Miguel de Allende, or Guanajuato city. Leon doesn´t have the promotional $$$ or hasn´t made attracting large numbers of tourists, national or foreign, but I sense that´ll change . . . because it has so much to offer.

About QRO and history, yes, it played a very important role in the Independence movement. However. other cities - particular some in Guanajuato state - are no less important or interesting from the historical standpoint. The good thing is that tourists have many choices in the Cuna de Independencia.

I visited Atotonilco today, one of the new designees of the World Heritage Site designation of UNESCO. It´s a powerful place to be, if you´re in the right frame of mind. Major restoration is underway - of the entire facilities - so it´s not as enjoyable a place to visit at the moment as it will be six months from now.

San Miguel de Allende has grown a lot, and the growth brings the good and the bad. The city, though, defines "Mexican heritage" and "Colonial" while other cities struggle to present themselves in that image. SMA doesn´t have to try, because the history and Colonial period seep from its every pore. Unless someone is planning a long-term stay, or relocation to here, after several days it´s likely they´ll get antsy to move-on . . . more particularly so during the most festive periods of the year.

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I stayed at the Senioral Platino, and will report on it in my trip report.

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