Thorn Tree travel forum

15

I have updated information on Kinabatagan and the Danum Valley Research Center (we decided to skip Batang Ai and wen tup the Rejang instead).

In Kinabatagan the B&B has gone upscale to be similair in price to Uncle Tan's and Jungle Lodge. It now cost 150pp for the first night +100 for transfer and includes meals and 2 boat trips. Each additional day costs 100pp and includes one additional boat trip. A better and cheaper option is the Sukau Homestay program. It is an effort started by the Kinabatagan Orangutan Conservation Project to engage the locals in the tourist trade, creating an economic incentive fo them to help sustain what is left of the forest. You stay in a villagers house in Sukau and can arrange boat trips either on a set program of more with greter flexibility a la carte. The cost is 20pp for lodging, 10pp for lunch or dinner. Boat trips vary based on destination and cost from 60rm for the mennango river (probiscis sightings every afternoon) to 100rm for a night cruise. You can have a guide in addition to the boat driver for another 20rm. We saw one orangutan downriver from sukau, that is also where we saw the most nests. to contact the homestay you can try email at sukau1@tm.net.my or phone at 089-230-268 or 013-899-5082. Another advantage of this program is, when the elephants are not around, they will take you into the conservation area whjere orangutan concentration is highest, you cannot get in with any other lodging. This option also becomes a cultural experience and helps conservation efforts in an area that defintiely needs it.

Danum Valley was very difficult to get into. They do not really want tourists and to get in you need to be a student, reseracher or have a refernce from a conservation or enviornmental organization. If you do not have a student or association ID it would be helpful to have a refernce letter or fax. We got our permit by showing up at their offices in KK (after failing over the phone) and pretending to be studying sustainable development. In any case, the contact who you need to speak with is Ms. Rose John Kiddi and she has an office in their main offices on the 12th floor of the MTM building in Likas (a suburb of KK). The cost varries based on what class of visitor you are with Malaysian researchers paying the least and tourists without credentials paying the most. But it is still much cheaper than the lodge, two people for four nights including dinners and transport it cost less than 1 night in the lodge with transport.
The forest was spectacular, we saw three orangutan here in four days and a large number of nests. The trails are mostly okay but easily lost in some places, luckily it is easy to navigate if lost.

All in all, over about 2 weeks in Ganung Palung, Kinabatagan area and Danum Valley we saw five wild orangutan and many nests. A very rewarding experience.

For more romanticized accounts of our experiences you can read my travelouge on Kinabatagan and Danum Valley

Avi and Karen's RTW Trip for a travelouge of our RTW trip and photos from some of our previous travels

16

This has been an extremley informative thread. I visited Camp Leakey about 15 years ago and am sad to hear that it is not working out to plan. Between then and now I've seen all sorts of disasters unfold there: the logging,the uncontrolled forest fires, and the conflicts between the local Dayaks and the "transmigrated", non-natives, I have grave concerns for the Orangs. Sadly, ecotourism may be the only impetus for the Indonesian governemnt to make any effort towards conservation.

Indonesia is by far the most fascinating country I have ever been to. I've always wondered if it might be better if each of the island groups became independent.

17

Staying at Kg. Batu Putih Walai Homestay is the cheapest, Batu Putih is the Village at the Kinabatangan Bridge where you start the boat ride to go to UT's Camp which is 25 minutes more/less. The Walai Homestay charge RM40 including meals/accommodation, the River Safari is RM60 per boat. All the Boatmen knows how to spot the wildlife, it was so easy anyway as wildlife tend to concentrate on the river banks-having not much forests left for them to hide. Do not be mislead about being in the jungle as almost all these areas are covered by Palm Oil plantaion. You will notice this when you start your boat trip from the bridge.There is also an interesting Caves here that holds some old wooden coffins run by the Sabah Museum for RM5. The Batu Putih Village is easy to reach - all buses from Kota Kinabalu, Ranau and Sandakan that goes to Lahad Datu, Semporna or Tawau all pass here. Very convenient if you are going onwards to Danum or Sipadan. The Batu Putih Village Walai Homestay was the first Homestay in Kinabatangan so it was surprising that nobody mentioned about this place.

18

GUNUNG PALUNG NOT WORTH A TRIP NOW

So I will complement post #13 as I just returned from a (most sad) trip to Gunung Palung ; by the way according to the porters' register last tourists were from 1st december 05 - that should be you #13 ?

I arrived in Ketapang by fast boat from Pontianak.
In Ketapang I went straight to Park offices - they have moved in January 2005 and can be now found here :
Jl. Gajah Mada, Kalinilam Ketapang
Telp. 0534-7707345

From the harbour very easy go straight on the road - it's an unmistakable light green building on the right handside, with a blue roof - though it is approx. 1 to 2 kms away from the harbour so you may consider taking an Ojek or Oplet.

Regarding the prices, post #13 is still very relevent ; porters are settled at 60.000 / day ; which you now pay upfront with park management, avoiding any further misunderstanding.

I went on my own and was fitted with two porters - very nice youngsters, great chaps - one of them carrying my backpack (which I was not expecting).
Looks like complaints from #13 have been heard - and fixed.

On Day 1, I was somehow surprised when my guide told me we were not to reach Lubuk Baji (the place with the waterfall where tourists are taken now) on the very day - but the next.
That was not what I had understood at Park Offices - so you may want that to be very clear to begin with.

We did not stop at the first shelter we met in the durian garden, but further up at the second one (they're wooden structures with plexiglas rooftops).
It was only 3:30PM and I would gladly have kept on - though I somehow felt the fact I was not carrying my backpack did disqualify me from insisting too much.

Second day - well the trek is hard but fun if you like walking upwards.
Thoug h we reached a nice plateau with impressive trees, where the guide and porters were quite taken aback as they were excpecting to meet gibbons that are "usually always there".
Bad luck - or was it ?

I was a bit surprised when we reached Lubuk Baji - a very simple campsite as already stated ; surprised as I was expecting the place to be bursting with wildlife, and it was strangely quiet.
I went to investitage the waterfall that gives its name to the area - had a shower there (which requires a little tenacity but is really rewarding).

When I came back I found the guide looked concerner ; he told me he was not sure we could see wildlife, as some people had been living here in a small hut - to gather durians.
After a frustrating walk around in a deserted area, I went to investigate the small hut.
Well I can understand why the wildlife has fled !
To gather durians, those b****** cleared a wide space under two huge durian trees ; "cleared" means destroying all vegetation, including felling a dozen trees or so - so that the durians fall on the floor and don't remain trapped in branches, and are easily spotted.
So there's a fucking clearing 25 X 15 meters no more than 30 meters away from the camp.
If you've been there you'll know it is a small area - so for now the place is sploiled.

Next morning we took advantage of the dawn calling of the gibbons to follow that sound track - I was able to see 4 of them before calling it quits one day before schedule - the place was just too sad.
So no probiscys, no hornbill, no Orang Utan...

I must say my Guide (Bandy) was really good all along - and kindly offered to refund part of the costs for the day I did not spend in the park ; thanks Bandy with a non sympathetic person it could really have been awful.

So I don't know if and when any of the wildlife will return to Lubuk Baji - if the problem is to last only for durian season or longer - but I certainly can't recommend going to Gunung Palung.
I warned my guide - telling him to inform his boss, that I'd post that report here - and that they would be welcome to report any update - hopefully improvement - on the situation.

What a sad experience - I am disgusted (oh and of course this clearing operation IS illegal)

Though to end on a lighter note - I was really angry that the place had been spoilt - and somehow used my...natural functions to spoil in turn the hut of those nasty persons ;-) - not very elegant, but deeply satisfying...

19

That was in fact me on December 1st; and I am disappointed to hear the current situation. The durian collection is big business for those villagers and I can't say I am too suprised that they would take it deeper into the park, but that is why rangers exist in the first place.

Maybe the Indonesian government will see all the goodwill being givin to its people by the world in Sumatra and return the favor in small ways; such as allowing researchers to return to the few areas left. My expectation however is that the situation will get worse in the near future and we will be lucky if there is anything left at all.

Avi and Karen's RTW Trip for a travelouge of our RTW trip and photos from some of our previous travels

20

This article appeared today in the Washington Post talking about the attempt to thwart loggers in Ganung Palung and conserve orangutan's habitat. You can see the whole aricle here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A51513-2005Feb24.html?sub=AR
(you need to register but it is free)

Apes Dwindle As Forests Fall In Indonesia
Conservationists Battle Loggers To Save Orangutans' Habitat

By Ellen Nakashima
Washington Post Foreign Service
Friday, February 25, 2005; Page A12

KALIMANTAN PROVINCE, Indonesia -- Three men in a canoe drew near swiftly from behind and overtook another canoe carrying a local environmentalist, Bastarin, on a river deep in the wilds of the Borneo rain forest.

Bastarin, out to stop illegal logging and protect the orangutans that live in Gunung Palung National Park, pulled harder on his oar to keep up with the men. He was sure they were illegal loggers, but they disappeared from view.

Avi and Karen's RTW Trip for a travelouge of our RTW trip and photos from some of our previous travels

21

Great apes pushed towards extinction (link to transcript at http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2005/s1320843.htm) - an interesting piece on the destruction of these magnificent animals. Birute Galdikas says that the future of orangutans as populations in the wild is very bleak- about 5 to 10 years. On being asked about rescuing orphaned young orangutan and reintroducing them into the wild. and can they go back once orangutans have been in captivity Birute replied with "Oh, absolutely. They're smart, they're opportunistic. The main thing that prevents them from going back is humans, the fact that humans will kill them.". There is no negative comment from her about the inability of orangutans raised by humans having never learned to fend for themselves or the point that fully-grown adult males and mothers with babies still showing up to be fed regularly are the most obvious testimony of this. Any comments from travellers that have seen this at the Rehabilitation Centres?

Bibbie

22

What you have noted happens all the time at most rehabilitation centers that do not transport their rehabilitants large distances from the center. At Bukit Lawang in Sumatra the apes were basically "feral" and "opportunistically (they're smart) " took advantage of the daily feedings, fruit given to them from self-appointed guides, and the convenient lounge chairs at the "Pongo Inn" to sleep. The group doing the work there have essentially broken away from the "tourism/rehab center" model and now place new, unhabituated orangutans in a stict quarantine, with only essential human contact. They are then placed in areas habitable for orangutans but away from tourists and other orangutans (to avoid competition and population pressures). This was done with the full knowledge of, if not the inspiration by, one of the original co-founders, Regina Frey...who saw that her efforts had gone terribly awry.

Birute's pledges at Tanjung Puting were notorious for this "bicultural behavior"...she babied them and provided human contact with almost all of the orangutans she had there. And reports are that baby orangutans died by the score from illnesses brought in from poor quarantine policies. An interesting book about this is Linda Spalding's "A Dark Place In The Jungle"

Outside Magazine Extracts

Reviews

If you've seen either the recent Nature programs on Tanjung Puting...the one starring Julia Roberts ("In The Wild") or the "From Orphan To King" you'll see a lot of this behavior.

I should point out that Willi Smits, who does almost all the rehabilitation work in Kalimantan avoids allowing any tourism to occur at his facilities. Once given adequate health care and basic training for climbing and foraging the young animals are placed in sort of an abbreviated "10-step" program that weans them of human contact...ultimately leading to release in areas isolated from close human contact.

So in both Kalimantan and Sumatra the new programs have evolved from the older systems established by Birute and others.

23

Quote

---

There is no negative comment from her about the inability of orangutans raised by humans having never learned to fend for themselves or the point that fully-grown adult males and mothers with babies still showing up to be fed regularly are the most obvious testimony of this. Any comments from travellers that have seen this at the Rehabilitation Centres?

---

As noted in the OP, I have been to Galdikas' main base at Camp Leakey in Tanjung Puting. Also as already noted in the OP, and now repeated by RedApe, the place is full of orangutans raised to be half-humans - most incredibly I saw some standing erect and walking on their two hind-legs!!!
Yeah, it must look very "cute" or "funny" to some people, but I think an animal with such behaviour belongs to a circus, not a national park. And the fact that orangutans show up to be fed regularly, in fact accounts for the very fact why the place is so popular/famous with tourists - "sightings" or "close-up encounters" can be guaranteed.
When I told an Indonesian park ranger who had earlier worked in TPNP that I thought feedings should be stopped there, he simply replied "They would die.".

Of course you can't expect Galdikas herself to advertise these facts - they are after all a testimony to her failure in rehabilitation.
I have always thought she should have stuck to field research - something she was once a great pioneer at.

My info & thoughts:
on East-Indonesia.info: Indonesia, West Papua, Maluku, Ternate, Ambon, Saparua, Banda, Kei
on VirtualTourist.com: Papua New Guinea, Philippines, New Caledonia, Eritrea, Djibouti
on Thorn Tree: Seeing Orangutans, Kalimantan, SE Asia Islands FAQ thread & Samoa Warnings

24

I'm off to Danum Valley in about 1 and a half weeks' time. After much investigation, I finally found a tour operator who does the Borneo Rainforest Lodge at decent prices. Check out Ping Anchorage. Compared to the 200 USD/day stated by Laszlo, you'd find yourself paying about 130 USD/day for a 2 days 1 night tour package (non-Malaysians). I've opted for the 3 days 2 nights package before going over to the field centre for another 2 nights. For the Field Centre, you're better off contacting Ms Rose (email: rosejkj@icsb-sabah.com.my). If you email her, don't expect an immediate response. She normally takes about 3 weeks to reply no thanks to their server which keeps going down. But she'll get things sorted out for you. Probably best to call at: +6088- 326327/326300

25

Sungi Kinabatangan

Recently visited this area and though I would add information both here and on Lazlo’s orang-utan thread.

We Stayed at Robert Chongs new Jungle Camp which is located near the village of Bilit. This area does not seem to have had to much development as is reported for the Sukau area were many wildlife lodges are located.

To get to Bilit you turn right of the main gravel road to Sukau about 10 km before you get there.

In addition to the Camp the village does have a Homestay program and they can arrange river trips from there for wildlife viewing I would think if you just turned up there you would not have a problem finding the Homestay places or Robert could help to put you in touch as he is keen to ensure that the villagers have a Economic stake in the wildlife.

Roberts Lodge is located down river from Bilit about 10 min by boat. Best way to get there is to stay at Roberts house near Sipilock, this is the well known Labuk B& B (contact Tel 089 533 190 E Mail Labukbb@tm.net.my and labukbb@yahoo.com ) At the moment Robert seems to run his trips from there for 2 or 3 days duration though this is largely up to the requirements of the group and any future booking requirements. I am sure when he gets more customers that he will base himself there and arrange transport to the area separately.

He as selected this area due to the over capacity at Sukau as he says there can be up to 20 boats on the same small tributary at busy times there. And for Eco tourism this is likely to have an effect on the wildlife. When we were on the river in Bilit in 4 trips we only noticed 3 other boats all like the ones we were in with only 2 to 5 people on board.

A little background to Robert if you haven’t heard of him, He is from the area and has worked in Kinabatangan for many years, he has been employed by the BBC as a guide for camera crews working on well known wildlife programs. He is both knowledgeable of the area and the bigger picture of the environmental and economic picture for such areas, no one managed to ask him any questions that he did not have the answers for. His guiding is excellent and he has a very good eye for spotting wildlife, though it’s the information and knowledge that make him exceptional. On our trip he did all of the daytime activities but left the night trip to the Younger guides he was training. Being older myself I appreciate how hard it can be to spot things at night due to the aging effect on the eyes so this was for the best.

The Jungle Camp is new and only recently opened its very pleasant there and the whole camp is surrounded by an electric fence to keep the nearby Elephants out. (To understand this you have to think of the effects of an Elephant scratching its side on a wooden hut). The whole camp is surrounded by elephant tracks (Beginners stuff if you want to get into tracking). As is nearby Bilit which has a small cannon to fire to scare them away from the village.

We saw Elephants, Proboscis Monkeys, 3 other kinds of Monkey, Crocodiles, Numerous Birds especially Hornbills, Lizards, Civet Cat and Leopard cat. The whole visit was really nice and.

Although I have not personally visited other areas of the River I would recommend this area particularly for the Elephants and the lack of crowds.

If anyone needs any more info please PM me.

Dislexic dave Travelblog Info on Banda, Banda Ache, Derawan, Sumatra etc.

26

Laszlo - excellently informative thread!
I`m definately interesting in going to Batang Ai, but really would like some kind of confirmation that Laszlo`s information is still accurate - has anyone out there done this trip recently.
I`m just worried that I`ll bust my gut getting there - to the rangers post, to find no accommodation, or full accommodation or something like that!
I don`t suppose there is an email (!?!) or phone number......
stupid questions i guess!

27

Naive questions, I would say.
Of course there is no email or post at the ranger post, and more surprisingly even the Kuching offices seem completely clueless.
ASFAIK, no one from this forum has visited Batang Ai NP ever since this thread was posted. I had people telling me they were going only in two cases, and both parties cancelled the trip in the end. What this means is that what little accomodation is available there is VERY unlikely to be full. If you do go, don't forget to take food and do post those updates you wanted from others now!
Actually I am somewhat disappointed by how unadventurous people seem to have become nowadays - it looks like gone are the days when travellers were looking for remoter, unspoilt places, and everyone only wants to visit places bookable online and recommended by plenty of others who have just been there! :-(

My info & thoughts:
on East-Indonesia.info: Indonesia, West Papua, Maluku, Ternate, Ambon, Saparua, Banda, Kei
on VirtualTourist.com: Papua New Guinea, Philippines, New Caledonia, Eritrea, Djibouti
on Thorn Tree: Seeing Orangutans, Kalimantan, SE Asia Islands FAQ thread & Samoa Warnings

28

Great thread, Laszlo! I've been doing my research for a trip to Sabah and Sarawk for wildlife viewing in November. Interestingly, the LP search feature did not turn up this thread when I searched a week ago. I only found it because it got to the first page. I'm still in the process of choosing which places to go, and this thread has been very helpful. We'll only have two weeks in Malaysian Borneo, so I need to choose carefully. This thread should help me do so!

29

Some new info......

Had a quick look at some Malaysia guidebooks yesterday....

They have limited but nontheless interesting info about Batang Ai.

Now I can`t remeber the info exactly cos they stopped me from taking notes in the shop! However it did mention that cheap boats can be caught from Jetty at Lubuk Antu taking you to Batang Ai.
Now, this seems progress, because I wouldnt say the the 200 it previously cost is particularly cheap. However what it didn`t confirm was whether these boats go to the Rangers posts/longhouses.
hmmmm.....

I really wanna do it!