USA flooded with Cuban immigrants?
Replies: 73 - Last Post: Apr 5, 2013 6:25 PM Last Post By: chefhagan
Mar 26, 2013 4:41 PM
Mar 26, 2013 4:42 PM
Mar 26, 2013 4:58 PM
Mar 26, 2013 7:14 PM
33That's interesting Altahabana. Why does it bother you so much if a European mentions your country? You're American and nobody takes offense that you like to talk about Cuba. I once spend two months doing a project about the Cuban community in Miami. I visited people in Cuba and found their relatives in Florida. Along with a colleague I interviewed more than 200 CA's. From filthy rich to dirt poor. From 75 year old Bay of Pigs veterans to newly arrived students. I have seen more than a few Cubans eating from trash cans on Calle 8, in Hialeah and even more so in South Beach. And more than a few homeless, I'm talking hundreds. Any which way you look at it, there are more homeless Cubans in Florida than in Cuba... A fact you will want to dispute I am sure.
If you want to believe Miami is the land of gold for all Cubans and contradict most economical experts in the U.S. that there is no crisis there, that's all dandy and sweat, good luck with that. I don't live there and spend little time in Europe these days, so I have little reason to argue one or the other.
It's not just a Cuban thing. Did you know that in 2012 more Colombians moved from Spain and USA to Colombia than there were Colombians moving from Colombia to Spain and USA? It's an interesting fact that has to do with a booming economy in some parts of SA and high employment rates in Spain and USA. I do acknowledge that the unemployment rate in Florida in January 2013 fell below the national U.S average for the first time in five years.
Actually we're in the same boat. The Atlantic union that has ruled the world for over half a decade is not doing so anymore. You guys can't keep up with the new booming powers and neither can we. And whenever Europe is doing bad, the U.S has problems, just like Europe has problems whenever the U.S economy is doing bad. I'm not naive enough to claim that Europe and the U.S. is not in deep sh.. without any realistic solution in the near future.
So, if I was a Cuban looking to leave, I would be heading to China or certain areas of SA. Not to Spain, not to Italy, not to the USA, not to Canada. Most likely, I would go to Ecuador and evaluate my options from there.
Mar 26, 2013 7:22 PM
34Oh, and to those of you that say a Cuban with $100/month in cash after all 'bills' are paid is not middle-class and doing well, you hang out with Cubans way richer than the ones I know. Actually, I do know a few that are very well off, but they tend to stay at home counting their money and watching their safe, so they're no fun.
Which is why - as brushed above - I can only afford to get drunk in peso bars, or that is where I can realistically drag my drinking buddies. They're too proud to accept a few rounds from the yuma, but not too proud to crawl home face down in the middle of the night :-)
I know a guy who runs a lottery, he makes exactly 20 CUC a week off that. That's 80 in a month. Plus 15 a month from his janitor job at a school. That's 95 in total each month. And he's the guy all the other guys come looking for when they need to borrow money because everybody knows he's got some cash. And that's in Havana, where money has less value than in the sticks. Again, I'm having a hard time understanding how 100 CUC/month is not a fat load of money for anybody living in the province. It's a nice income in Havana, it's mucha plata in an all out peso economy in Oriente.
Mar 27, 2013 5:41 AM
Why does it bother you so much if a European mentions your country?
It doesn't bother me in the least. Actually I thought my critique of your comment was pretty low-key. You implied that the US is in an economic crisis (whatever that means) and I disagreed. The US economy is not robust and thriving, but it is stable and not in crisis, at least in the sense most people would define that word.
I took exception to your anecdote about the re-patriated Cuban because that is hardly typical of the economic-social status and standard of living of the overwhelming majority of Cuban immgrants in south Florida. I haven't interviewed 200 CAs, but I personally know a lot more than that and their socio-economic situations range all over the map.
I don't know the purpose of your survey, but there are a number of peer reviewed, published studies using accepted social science methodology that paint a more positive picture of Cuban Americans and how they have fared and how they compare with other immigrant groups. As I said earlier in the thread the motivation for most Cubans who want to immigrate is a lot more than some illusion that the streets of Miami are "paved with gold."
Mar 27, 2013 7:20 AM
36"the motivation for most Cubans who want to immigrate is a lot more than some illusion that the streets of Miami are "paved with gold."
I think that's up for discussion... For many the main factor behind an ambition to cross to Florida is formed by music videos passed on DVD's and an illusion that one only has to reach U.S oil to live a life of gold chains, big cars and sweaty jebas in bikinis. We can agree that there are also educated Cubans who have a realistic impression of yuma. Whether that is the majority, I have my doubts.
You'll also have to differ between the group of mainly well-off and well-educated Cubans who made the leap in the first 10-15 years after the revolution and the mainly desperate and uneducated group that went during Mariel in 1994. And those who have gone illegally since. Cubans who have lived in the U.S. since the 60's and their families are generally speaking doing a thousand times better than those who went in the last 10-20 years. The former can hardly even be considered Cubans. Some of them don't even speak Spanish. As opposed to the later, some of them don't even speak 10 words of English.
As for the rest, I appreciate your follow-up, and I have no doubts the Cuban community is doing better than the average immigrant group, but whether that says a lot, is again another question. We'll probably also have to disagree on whether or not the U.S is experiencing an economical crisis.
Mar 27, 2013 2:56 PM
37An interesting difference of opinion. I find I have a slightly different understanding of the situation in Cuba than either of you describe--and I know nothing about Miami. I'd write what I've experieinces, and my wife's family in the last year or so, but the last time I took the effort to explain their circumstances, the new Thorntree didn't bither to show what was fairly long and descriptive. I'll just write that my sister in law--lost her gov't job a year or so ago (she made about $15/mo. After a while, my wife encouraged her to start a business (Hairdresser). She went back to school (free--although she was well known as being good at that anyways), and now makes about $80 CUC (not CUP) a week. Actually, only 1/2 that much as she has a relative working there as well, and shares equally. This is AFTER her expences. I know of numerous other "jobs" that people in this neighborhood have, where they make close to or more than $60/m. CUC. ( of course they make the oney in CUP. ) My experience with those that make money, whether in Havana or in the country, is that nobody lets anyone else know they have money--whether it is made from business, relatives overseas, prostitution, or any other way. I know some older retirees (in Cuba these people are what we might consider VERY poor), I know some Casa owners, but mostly I know my family members, and the people who live on their street (and have for years), who work Gov't jobs, and often have various side employment--where they all make more than at the Gov't job--even if they attend regularily, and get their bonuses. I wrote much more than I intended--maybe this time it will be posted.
Mar 27, 2013 5:48 PM
Mar 27, 2013 9:03 PM
Mar 28, 2013 5:39 PM
Mar 28, 2013 6:12 PM
41If I was rich I would be living in a country where it is fun to throw money around and act like a complete a$$hole. Drive huge cars, waste money at casinos, eat at the best restaurants in the world, own my own helicopter. A place where I could have super-duper-extreme-speed WiFi and spend hours in world class malls throwing around my dirty money and buying loads of designer stuff I don't need.
Cuba is no fun for a really uncharming rich SOB.
If I had a 100 dollars a month and a libreta, I would prefer Cuba over any country, though. Only in Cuba would I be able to eat out at least a couple of times a month and get drunk every Saturda with a disposable income of 100 dollars. And not even have to worry about using that money on health insurance or saving it up for my kids to go to college one day.
If I didn't have a libreta and the rights of a Cuban, no way in hell I'd be in Cuba without money.
Mar 28, 2013 8:32 PM
Mar 29, 2013 4:56 AM
Mar 29, 2013 8:02 AM
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