The richness of languages ... - Thorn Tree travel forum

The richness of languages

Replies: 52 - Last Post: 11-Dec-2009 13:15 Last Post By: tonieja

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Posted
06-Nov-2009 02:07
by: JeremyintheCzechRep

Posts: 551
Registered: 07/02/07

The richness of languages

I recently heard that the Japanese use the same word, 'yaku' for baking, frying and grilling. However Japanese has three words for 'wear', depending on whether you are wearing a shirt, socks or glasses. I've also heard that eskimos have 417 words for 'urban myth'.

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Posted
06-Nov-2009 03:55
by: Shuffaluff

Posts: 1,833
Registered: 12/10/07

1

In Hebrew there are different words for wearing (1) a hat, (2) a necktie, (3) a garment such as a dress, shirt, trousers, (4) socks, (5) shoes, (6) glasses, (7) medals or jewels. Not an urban myth.

Posted
06-Nov-2009 04:36
by: igor

Posts: 832
Registered: 02/02/01

2

In Slovene there are 3 words for washing 1-clothes, 2-dishes, 3-body. So dishwasher and washing machine are both called literally 'washing machine', only with different 'washing'. Not in Serbo-Croatian though.

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Posted
06-Nov-2009 08:55
by: mathilda

Posts: 2,955
Registered: 06/03/02

3

italian has one word to say "to feel", "to sense", and "to hear"

Dipsiz bir kuyuya du"stu"gu"mu" cok sonradan anladim

Posted
06-Nov-2009 09:30
by: palindroma

Posts: 692
Registered: 31/08/01

4

One little thing that surprised me many years ago when I was a young kid learning English was the fact that there were two different words in English for hand and foot digits (fingers and toes); there is only one word in Spanish.

Posted
06-Nov-2009 09:46
by: Lonelier_Planet

Posts: 638
Registered: 17/02/04

5

The yaku part is correct. It can mean fry bake or grill.

The distinction comes from the object of the verb. If you talk about cakes, then obviously yaku means to bake. If you talk about eggs, then it must mean to fry. If something can be either grilled or fired, like a sausage, you can just clarify it by adding more information (abura ni yaku, where "abura" means oil of fat, would mean "to fry in oil or fat").

Japanese verbs for wearing clothes or accessories are more complex than what OP described.

Haku: to wear things on the lower part of the body, like shoes, socks, pants, skirts

Kaburu: to wear something on the head (kaburu = to put over one's head)

Kakeru: to wear glasses (glasses = megane; megane o kakeru) (kakeru = to hang)

Kiru: to wear something on the upper body or to wear clothes in general

Tsukeru: to wear brooches, jewels, corsages and so on (tsukeru = to attach)

Shimeru: to wear sashes, belts or neckties (shimeru = to fasten or tie)

Suru: to wear small items of clothing or small ornaments or accessories (suru = to do)

There may be one or two more, but I can't remember them off hand.

Obviously there's some overlap among all these, and it's not a serious error if you mix up, for example, tsukeru with suru. Only the purists would mind.

I reside at The Old House, Pickbottom Lane, Sickly Green, Beaumont Saint Lazarus, Buckinghamshire, UK.

Youse are all welcome.

Posted
06-Nov-2009 09:55
by: nutraxfornerves

Posts: 10,666
Registered: 09/06/01

6

Tok Pisin is fascinating in how it deals with a limited vocabulary. Haus is house, but also any building. So a church is "haus bilong god." A library is "haus buk bilong ol men na meri." (book house that belongs to all men and women). "Haus sik" is a hospital. Her majesty lives in the "haus bilong kwen."

Gras is grass. It can also be fur or something like that. So, "gras bilong ai" is an eyelash or eyebrow. "Gras nogut" is a weed. "Mausgras" (mouth grass) is a beard or mustache. The leaves that a Huli dancer wears on his backside are "ass gras."

Turkish does not have a verb that means "to have." Instead, it uses two verbs, one of which means "to exist" and the other is "to not exist." You cannot say "I have a car" or I do not have children." You must say "My car exist" or "My children do not exist."

I've also heard that eskimos have 417 words for 'urban myth'.

Perfect!

Nutrax
The plural of anecdote is not data

Posted
06-Nov-2009 09:59
by: sneaker_fish

Posts: 18,971
Registered: 30/12/01

7

Must remember the eskimo line!

Wahoo! I found out how to put in a signature! Sharp as a marble.

Posted
06-Nov-2009 20:47
by: stormboy

Posts: 2,148
Registered: 03/03/02

8

Jakobson said that 'languages differ essentially in what they must convey and not in what they can convey'.

Posted
06-Nov-2009 23:01
by: mathilda

Posts: 2,955
Registered: 06/03/02

9

tok pisin sounds very cool indeed

it is not exsactly what this thread is about but russian is really fuzzy about whether you drive somewhere or fly there or go there by foot, and whether you just go there, or go back as well.

in english (french, german italian...) you can just say "i'm going to mexico this summer", meaning on an overseas holiday, or "i'm going to myt granny's house in the south" in the same way you would say "i'm just quickly going to the supermarket". not so in russian

i had an italian friend who lamented this difficulty of russian jumping up from his seat very italianstyle and exclaiming "in italy it is all just "andare, andare, andare" and then you guys come along and you don't even have two different words for the very basic, and very different concepts of 'world' and 'peace''' (both covered by the terse "mir" in russian. if i didn't know that etymologically they used to be two words i could philosophize that this fact must be due to the great slavic idealism which assumes that these two concepts should simply be two sides of the global state of things, although they sadly never are)

Edited by: mathilda

Dipsiz bir kuyuya du"stu"gu"mu" cok sonradan anladim

Posted
07-Nov-2009 00:16
by: VinnyD

Posts: 21,683
Registered: 06/10/04

10

Good line, stormboy.

#9 -- Mir always reminds me of Greek kosmos, meaning both universe and order.

Meet VinnyD.

Posted
07-Nov-2009 03:30
by: iviehoff

Posts: 1,522
Registered: 02/03/05

11

Since you are in the Czech republic, you probably noticed that they have several different verbs for putting on/taking off different items of clothing.

tok pisin sounds very cool indeed

It has vocabulary items arising from the popular colonial misconception that it makes it easier for a foreigner to understand you if you use slang. So whilst it might seem funny on first acquaintance that (in the original English spellings) know is savvy, boy is monkey, woman is Mary, and an accident is bugger-up, I think it actually rather sad.

Posted
07-Nov-2009 04:18
by: bjd

Posts: 4,105
Registered: 13/01/05

12

On the contrary, mathilda, Russian is not "really fuzzy" -- it's much more specific than languages that only say "to go" or "andare".

Posted
07-Nov-2009 15:24
by: LGM

Posts: 390
Registered: 02/03/02

13

I'm not sure of the exact number but there are numerous words for "ice" and "snow" in Eskimo.

Indonesian has a few interesting ones:

the verb 'to finish' has 2 separate words: 'selasai' meanig 'to finish' (it's over), 'habis' meanig 'to finish' (no more).

Lile Tok Pisin Indonesian has a few words that, combined with other words, have seevral meanings, there are 2 examples I can think of:

Rumah means house, rumah sakit (literally sick house) means houspital, rumah makan(literally meaninng house to eat) means restaurant.

Mata means eye, mata hari( literally eye of the day) means sun, mata uang (literally eye of money) means currency and mata air( Literally eye of the water) means spring.

ra'ik kau raintang sara tei kau ngasiang

Posted
07-Nov-2009 15:33
by: palindroma

Posts: 692
Registered: 31/08/01

14

Similar to the variety of snow/ice nouns in Eskimo, I once read an article in The New Yorker in which the author mentioned that there where many words for hangover in Ukranian. I don't know if that's true or not though.

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